Senao 2611 CB3 Deluxe Challenges

Discussion in 'Wireless Internet' started by Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 2, 2006.

  1. New topic heading - Jeff Liebermann had posted on this subject in
    another thread:

    Thanks, Jeff, for the post. Just a couple of comments inline:

    I'll try googling for a good report. With any luck it will show up in
    something like this and I can actually get to talk with someone about
    how they succeeded. I'm hopeful of getting a cogent (well,
    technically, *any* response would be somewhat surprising) reply to a
    very complete RFH from Senao corporate tech support.
    I don't have a clue (perhaps you could help?) about how to further
    separate. Just as a basis (removed during the ethernet portions of the
    test), I have a Hawking USB antenna. I'ts what makes this post
    possible. It also (with its configuration utility) tells me the SSID,
    Mac and strengths of all the visible SSIDs. At least fair for seeing
    what to expect from the Senao gear.

    With the internal wifi card disabled, and the Hawking unplugged, I set
    about solely to make (one of the) units perform as a bridge. Perhaps
    it's a matter my expectations. As already specified elsewhere, I am
    clueless about networking minutiae. However, what I expected was to be
    able to find an AP and communicate with it, through an antenna attached
    to one of these units configured as a bridge, in much the same fashion
    as I do with my internal wifi antenna (disabled for all but the most
    infrequent appearances outside either my home or boat) or my USB
    antenna. So, if that's the problem, you're quite right, I need to
    start over. "Over" in the most basic sense, too, as, if I can't do it
    as above, I clearly don't have any clue about what hardware is required
    to get me communicating with a remote AP...

    Onward to separation and defeat (so far, any way):

    1) The ethernet portion of my testing setup seems to work just fine,
    as demonstrated by my ability to configure the card when connected
    (more below). I can reliably configure it to DHCP or specify IP and
    subnets, along with extras in the advanced section, in the event I
    wanted to use it to directly talk to more than one piece of gear, each
    with its own IP and subnet set. I *am* rather irritated by Windoze'
    inability to toggle between DHCP and specific settings, requiring
    manual entry each time I leave the DHCP. So, link 1 works. As a
    subset, it behaves in the same fashion whether I use the supplied 6'
    crossover, or the 4" pigtail (the better to use when two are in a small
    box) I made up. So, links 1a and 1b work.

    2) The power supply appears to work. That is, it powers the unit and I
    can reach/configure the unit once it's powered. So, link 2 works.

    3) The antenna (the one I expect to use with the bridge) (and the
    pigtail connector) appears to work. That's because it sees the same
    APs, in the same power range, as the Hawking does. Because I have been
    unable to make the unit work, I've not bothered to attempt verifying
    the other antenna. If I ever succeed with the bridge configuration,
    I'll check out the duck. Link 3a works; 3b, with its different pigtail
    (different antenna end) is left untouched for the moment.

    4) The unit itself is a very mixed bag. There are 3 lights and a
    reset button.

    The antenna light rarely comes on, though, over the more than 12
    months that I've been valiantly (foolishly is more likely) attempting
    to make this system work, it has, in the past, come on. Removing and
    reinserting the antenna doesn't change that result. In the times when
    it works to that level, it sees the same SSID as my Hawking does, so
    the connection point and coax pigtail of the antenna work. 4a is
    flaky.

    The power light comes on when attached to the wall wart by the
    provided plug. It also goes off when the manual reset button is
    pushed. 4b seems to work.

    Pushing the manual reset returns the card to factory defaults. 4c
    seems to work.

    The ethernet light comes on when there's a cable inserted (note
    that it doesn't mean anything about connectivity - just that there's
    something in the hole), and off when removed. I can also configure the
    unit when the ethernet cord or pigtail is inserted and the unit
    returned to factory default. 4d seems to work.

    So, there's the mechanical report on the unit. Both (I have two,
    supposedly to make an AP/Bridge pair) behave in the same fashion
    mechanically.

    5) The performance report you probably saw as a part of the "up the
    mast" thread. Without repeating it here, I sequenced through each of
    the available options (select one of two possibilities), starting with
    factory default, attempting to communicate at each point. Various
    failures resulted. Both of these units is supposedly able to perform
    as either a bridge or AP. However, I've been testing them only in the
    bridge mode. Until I have a working bridge, there's no point in trying
    to make it communicate through an AP unit.

    Regardless of the result of the many different configuration option
    selections, and the various different information returns (see SSID,
    don't see SSID, associate SSID, don't associate SSID, release IP, don't
    renew, etc.), and regardless of the configuration of the NIC, I have
    not succeeded in passing/retrieving data to/from the net. That's in
    any case, but in particular when (in the times when it *will*
    associate) associated with the SSID I'm using right now, therefore
    confirmed open and available. So, 5 is a failure.

    Given that I have not been able to make this perform as a bridge, I've
    not gone beyond that point for quite a while. If I could ever make the
    bridge work (neither unit works as a bridge, both have current firmware
    flashes), I could go on to attempting to make the setup (the same as
    provided me by my vendor) Mr. Navas has asserted will work perform,
    whether the two units were piggybacked or separated by lots of ethernet
    cable and a 60+ foot metal column (sorry, I know you sail - I'm just
    frustrated).

    So, how may I further divide and experiment? At this point I have no
    illusions about the conquering part. The stubborn side of me wants to
    know WTF is going on.

    L8R

    Skip

    Morgan 461 #2
    SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
    http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
    bought her

    The Society for the Preservation of Tithesis commends your ebriated
    and scrutible use of delible and defatigable, which are gainly, sipid
    and couth. We are gruntled and consolate that you have the ertia and
    eptitude to choose such putably pensible tithesis, which we parage.
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 2, 2006
    #1
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  2. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    Again, follow my last few responses to you. Pay particular attention to
    IP address issues, written to address your particular problem, and now
    part of the wiki.
     
    John Navas, Jul 4, 2006
    #2
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  3. Hi, John,

    I must have missed those responses, as I didn't see any which addressed
    IP issues. And, as you may have seen in the firmware download post,
    I'm not really sure what I have.

    However, here's an update on what I've been doing:

    *** laptop (during radio configuration):
    IP: 192.168.1.252
    gateway: 192.168.1.1

    *** CB3 bridge:
    point-to-multipoint mode
    SSID DUMMY (to be changed later)
    IP: 192.168.1.251
    gateway: 192.168.100.1

    *** CB3 access point:
    Set for CH 11
    SSID BoatAP
    IP: 192.168.1.250
    gateway: 192.168.100.1

    First, I configured the units, bare (no antennae), one at a time. As
    indicated in other posts, I've never had a difficulty reaching the
    configuration pages. Curiously, when I did the switch to AP from
    bridge (recall that I'd been testing both units attempting to succeed
    in surfing with either of them in bridge mode), it vacillated, showing
    on the screen that it was changing back and foth several times. A
    refresh of the screen (giving it a kick?) finally got it to settle down
    in AP mode. I commenced setting up the parameters, naming and
    otherwise preparing to make the two interact. Leaving both powered up,
    I disconnected the NIC line. So far, so good.

    Holding my breath, I connected them. Every other time I'd connected
    them, I'd get immediate IP conflict messages. This time, nothing.
    Hallelujah. Movement from where we'd been. These were both sitting on
    my keyboard (I use an external keyboard with my laptop) and so my
    internal wifi saw 'boat AP' loud and clear. So, I set about seeing if
    they could communicate.

    I started with the bridge (ethernet NIC and crossover cable, with the
    stick antenna),set on the cabin roof, with the stick hung from the same
    place as the Hawking I've been communicating through, and beat on it
    umpteen times. Varying between "dummy" - which would not scan,
    "wireless" (the default, which also would not scan), "sailing router" -
    the AP I use with the Hawking adapter (sorry about the designation of
    antenna earlier).- and (any) - the empty space for the SSID
    specification, which *would* scan, I was eventually able to make it
    associate with the 'sailing router'

    The first several tries, it would not surf. More beating and toggling
    (ok, resetting to different parameters) of SSID finally yielded an
    association which would surf. Unfortunately, that was in the "any"
    (nothing shown in the SSID line) mode, so I tried again. Eventually I
    succeeded in getting an association with 'sailing router' which would
    surf. During this bit, no other changes than SSID designationi were
    done, so I have no idea whey it succeeded and other times didn't. None
    the less... A first, in more than a year. If I could make this
    stable, that, at least, is a starting point. Given that my computer use
    would nearly always be at the nav (well, I'd be more comfortable
    somewhere else, but it serves, at least!), being tethered by cat5 is at
    least manageable.

    So, I went on to reconnect the other unit, leaving the one which I'd
    succeeded in the same state, powered up, but not connected to anything.
    I attached both antennas to the appropriate pieces. I had them both
    powered with an extension cord, and now they were on the cabin roof
    under the dodger, with the stick hanging from the same place as the
    Hawking, and the duck hanging into the salon below.

    So, holding my breath, I connected them again with the crossover
    pigtail. No IP conflicts!! That's a first, in a year plus.

    Next was to turn on the internal wifi adapter. Holy cow! It
    connected.

    I wish that were the end of the story. Unfortunately, it's not. While
    I was able to surf and mail for a while, and at what seemed to be
    excellent speed and connectivity, the IP conflict reared its ugly head
    again, and things ground to a halt.

    Power cycling, by unplugging the extension cord, worked for about a
    minute (after perhaps an hour of uptime before).

    Fast forward to today, where I've been attempting to make it stable
    again. Still (irregular - no predictability) IP conflicts, whether the
    internal adapter is in DHCP or static mode as above. I can only
    irregularly interrogate the bridge in static mode, never the AP, with
    the internal adapter. As I type, having just repowered after a couple
    hours off, there isn't an IP conflict, but my internal adapter can't
    reach the bridge, where it did a moment ago It shows connected with
    excellent strength to the AP, but can't interrogate it, either. Of
    course, when I go to dhcp, I'll not be able to interrogate them at all,
    and, having repowered in the "any" (no SSID in the blank), it connected
    to the strongest signal, which isn't open. Attempting to reset it to
    'sailing router' - the one my Hawking adapter uses successfully - has
    made the bridge unreachable again.

    So, there you have it. Like "Sleepers" - the movie - there was a brief
    period of lucidity, but the system has returned to its former dementia
    and insanity. No rhyme or reason for the IP conflicts. Ditto the
    ability or not to reach the bridge or the AP for reconfiguration (in
    the connected-to-each-other, over-wifi-URL/web-based interface).

    So, while I don't know that I complied with your demands to follow your
    instructions (I don't know that I know enough to do it properly or as
    desired, and I didn't see the posts about IP stuff), this is what I
    *did* do, and how it worked and then didn't.

    Physical Address: 00-11-09-16-F9-33
    IP Address: 192.168.1.252
    Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
    Default Gateway: 192.168.1.1
    DNS Server:
    WINS Server:

    That's what I see as connected right now - the IP is that of the "boat
    AP", ditto the other stuff - from the "wireless connection status"
    screen details section of the screen indicating my connection to 'boat
    AP' with excellent signal strength, at 11mbps.

    Going to dhcp configuration in my internal adapter yields a connection
    to the unwanted AP - and since I can't get to the bridge to specify
    which one I want, I'm stuck. Returning to the static state above
    doesn't cure that.

    This is the ipconfig /all for dhcp, with beacon being the closed
    system; I can't get to the bridge to tell it to go to the proper SSID:

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /all

    Windows IP Configuration

    Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : NavigationLaptop
    Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
    Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Unknown
    IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
    WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
    DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : beaconwifi.lan

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : beaconwifi.lan
    Description . . . . . . . . . . . : 802.11g MiniPCI Wireless
    Network Ada
    pter
    Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-11-09-16-F9-33
    Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
    Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.121
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
    DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
    DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
    Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Wednesday, July 05, 2006
    3:32:49 PM
    Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Thursday, July 06, 2006
    3:32:49 PM

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

    Any other ideas/troubleshooting?

    Thanks.

    L8R

    Skip, rebedding stanchion and ladder bases
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 5, 2006
    #3
  4. Hi, again.

    Just powered the Senaos up again, in dhcp, and got this:

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

    Windows IP Configuration


    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

    Windows IP Configuration


    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : beaconwifi.lan
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.121
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

    This is the strongest signal; it's also a pay site. For the first
    several minutes, I have not had an IP conflict. Now, let's try to
    interrogate the bridge with a static IP (hawking adapter unplugged, in
    case there's any possibility that's an IP conflict generator):

    It came up with the SSID at "any" - I reset to 'sailing router' and got
    a result of connected to 'non spec' and 44444444444 as the mac address.
    Redoing the previous steps, I got the same result.

    Reversing direction, going back to 'any' (blank address) and scanning
    again, the scan sees all the correct places as well as 'boat AP' - the
    2611 AP unit - which I assume it would now try to associate if I were
    to do another reset. Yup.

    Still in the internal adapter, in static mode so I can talk to the
    bridge, again specifying 'sailing router' - the one I first succeeded
    with: It first failed, then tried again, failing, yet again, with "The
    server at 192.168.1.251 is taking too long to respond." A 'repair'
    (windoze release/renew automation) failed to get me back in to the
    bridge.

    Returning to DHCP, I again showed 'boat AP' as excellent, but it would
    not log in.
    ipconfig release/renew failed.

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

    Windows IP Configuration


    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

    Windows IP Configuration

    An error occurred while renewing interface Wireless Network Connection
    : unable
    to contact your DHCP server. Request has timed out.

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

    Another 'repair' failed as well.

    So, I don't know what we learn from this other than 'any' seems to be
    the only way the bridge will communicate, now, and my access to the
    bridge (through the AP) is flaky. Following these failures, going back
    to static, attempting to access (if I can't associate the 'boat AP' I'm
    not sure what I'll gain by it - hm. Lemme try the Hawking and see what
    that association brings me: it started by quickly locking on, but then
    not only would not bring up the "beacon" site, but gave me the message
    of low or un-connectivity.), again, with another repair, again failed.

    So, at this particular time, while I have no IP conflicts, I also have
    no communication with 'boat AP' from either the built in or USB
    adapters, having just reconnected the Hawking but failing to get the IP
    despite nearly 100% signal strength and high-80s quality.

    Reconnecting the Hawking adapter and asking for 'sailing router'
    connected nearly immediately; here's the ipconfig on that (with the
    Hawking USB adapter - "connection 25" - doing the talking):

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /all

    Windows IP Configuration

    Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : NavigationLaptop
    Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
    Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Unknown
    IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
    WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected
    Description . . . . . . . . . . . : 802.11g MiniPCI Wireless
    Network Adapter
    Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-11-09-16-F9-33

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
    Description . . . . . . . . . . . : XPC 802.11b/g Wireless Kit
    #3
    Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-0E-3B-02-E9-B7
    Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
    Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.102
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1
    DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1
    DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 65.32.1.65
    65.32.1.70
    Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Thursday, July 06, 2006
    9:08:44 AM
    Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Friday, July 07, 2006
    9:08:44 AM

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

    Windows IP Configuration

    No operation can be performed on Wireless Network Connection while it
    has its media disconnected.

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

    Windows IP Configuration

    No operation can be performed on Wireless Network Connection while it
    has its me
    dia disconnected.

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

    Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

    Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

    Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
    IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.102
    Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
    Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1

    C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

    For the 20 or so minutes I played with it before unplugging, again, I
    got no IP conflicts - but can't communicate, either...

    I started all this with the presumption that these units were
    defective, or they should have worked as designed. I haven't changed
    my mind.


    L8R

    Skip

    Morgan 461 #2
    SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
    http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
    bought her

    "Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
    nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
    messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
    In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
    that's the charm of it.
    Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
    destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
    get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
    particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
    do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 6, 2006
    #4
  5. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    <http://groups.google.com/groups?as_...wireless&as_usubject=&as_uauthors=john+navas>
    Then get and flash the proper firmware.
    As I wrote previously:

    If you want my help, stick to my step by step. If you want to keep
    [thrashing] around with other stuff you'll have to do it without me.

    Jeff likewise (and more clearly):

    I've avoided trying to help you because frankly, I don't think you're
    approaching the problem systematically. Each section of your wireless
    maze needs to be individually tested before it is conglomerated into a
    floating wireless LAN. Despite advice to disassemble the parts and
    piece and test them, you've consistently tried to make it work as a
    total system. That won't work (unless you're very lucky) and certainly
    is useless for pointing the finger at the problem or the culprit.
    Divide and conquer.

    Read that again, carefully. It's very good advice.

    For the amount of time I've spent thus far trying to help you, the
    problem should have long since been solved. I just don't have the time
    to wade through all the stuff you're posting and try to make some sense
    of it.
    I disagree. I think you're probably making some basic mistake.
    Unfortunately, I can't make sense of what you're posting, and you won't
    follow my advice, so I can't really help you.
    I'm making no demands. I'm asking you to work with me, taking it little
    step by little step, but you've simply ignored that. If you don't
    understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If you'd rather do it
    your way, then good luck to you.
     
    John Navas, Jul 6, 2006
    #5
  6. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    dOn 6 Jul 2006 06:28:34 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
    I just don't have the time to wade through all the stuff you're posting
    and try to make some sense of it. I've been asking you to work with me,
    taking it little step by little step, but you've simply ignored me (and
    Jeff). If you don't understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If
    you'd rather do it your way, then good luck to you.
    I disagree. I think you're probably making some basic mistakes.
    Unfortunately, I can't make sense of what you're posting, and since you
    won't follow my advice, I can't really help you.
     
    John Navas, Jul 6, 2006
    #6
  7. Hi, John, and any observers...

    It's clear that I don't even know enough to ask the right questions.
    Every time I think I've directly followed your instructions I've been
    castigated for failure to do so. That I didn't ask questions was a sign
    I thought I understood your steps to follow - and reported back on the
    results of executing (what I thought was) them.

    Every time I've attempted to KISS - just one device, just one set of
    parameters - it's apparently not sufficient, witness Jeff and your
    agreement with his assessment.

    My attempts to totally isolate any potential duplication of effort,
    extraneous gear or other obfuscations, starting with factory defaults
    and one single device, and executing (and reporting) the steps
    specified was greeted with - as best as I understood it - No, not that
    way, follow my instructions. Any attempts at further clarification or
    repetition of the same tasks to attempt duplication of results met with
    the same results on reporting.

    Attempts to further isolate, by working from the computer out and
    analyzing the success or failure of each segment through the 2611
    itself are, again, apparently insufficient. I don't have a clue about
    how to further break it down and isolate parts, operating alone (and, I
    thought, not together as complained about before, recent events, with
    partial successes notwithstanding).

    So, I'm lost.

    Sorry to bother you (all)...

    L8R

    Skip
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 7, 2006
    #7
  8. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    As I wrote before:

    Please, please, please don't fool around like this! Just do my step by
    step. Don't add anything, futz with other gear, etc. Just get Senao #1
    connected to a *remote* (not your own) access point on a valid channel
    with good signal, and then get DHCP working. Remember the bit in my
    prior reply about having two configurations, one (manual IP) where you
    can talk to the Senao but not the Internet, and another (DHCP) where
    you can talk to the Internet but not the Senao. Do you fully
    understand the why of that?

    To summarize:
    1. Flash and configure Senao #1 as a client bridge.
    2. Equip Senao #1 with an antenna.
    3. Hook the computer to Senao #1 with an Ethernet cable.
    4. Configure computer to configure Senao #1.
    5. Browse to Senao #1 management interface.
    6. Connect Senao #1 to known good remote wireless service.
    7. Record & report all Senao #1 settings
    8. Reconfigure computer for DHCP.
    9. Note carefully what happens. Give it at least 2 minutes.
    10. Record & report all computer settings (IPCONFIG /ALL).

    No other hardware!
    No other steps!
    Nothing else!
     
    John Navas, Jul 7, 2006
    #8
  9. Hi, John, and thanks for coming back. I know I try your patience.

    One question before I proceed. That's because I believe I've done all
    the steps you ask below - but I've not reported them here.

    I cannot reliably connect to any other than one pay service (to which I
    don't subscribe). For whatever reason, the bridge locks on to it when
    in the 'any' (no specified SSID) mode, despite its being only the 3rd
    stronges signal in the area. In the rare instances where I've been
    able to specify and associate 'sailing router' (the one my Hawking
    adapter associates at my command), when I do a release/renew, sometimes
    the bridge comes up (renewed) with the pay site.

    Other times, when I specifiy 'sailing router' I get the 'non-spec'
    association, 44444444 mac and random channels, including 12. FWIW,
    that's also true of any other of the scans' results, most of the time.

    So, my question:

    Do you want me to associate the pay channel, even though I won't be
    able to surf/mail/tracert, etc.? I *will* be able to ipconfig /all,
    /release, /renew on that, and any attempt to surf presents a log-in
    screen in whatever web browser I use.

    I *may* even get lucky and have it be stable enough that it connects to
    'sailing router' - it remained stable for an hour during the both-units
    test I did which I reported - but I'm not holding my breath. Last
    night, doing what you want, above, it did, and I was able to surf and
    mail. But as quickly as I "release/renew"ed it locked back into the
    pay site and over an hour of beating (power recycle, change SSID from
    'any - nothing in the space - to something other than the pay site) on
    it didn't succeed in reassociating the open site. Worse (making me
    wonder about the viability of the unit), it began taking extremely long
    to respond, and very frequently timed out the URL.

    So, even though I won't be able to communicate (other than to do the
    handshake), do you want the results of the association to the pay site?

    Thanks.

    L8R

    Skip
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 7, 2006
    #9
  10. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    Wi-Fi clients should ideally go for the *best* signal, which isn't
    necessarily the *strongest* signal -- signal quality is affected by
    other factors; e.g.,interference.
    I'm guessing the Hawking is a "g" client. (I don't know for sure
    because you've never clearly identified it.) The Senao is a "b" client.
    You *can't* compare them directly unless you put the Hawking in "b-only"
    mode.
    What the heck is "sailing router"?! Is that the actual SSID? What is
    the hardware and how is it configured? How strong is the signal?
    Sounds like Senao #1 firmware isn't USA spec. Very important to make
    *sure* Senao #1 has the latest USA spec client bridge firmware.
    So Senao #1 *is* working properly, except for the association and
    non-USA channel issues. Good.
    IPCONFIG on your computer won't affect Senao #1 (which is just a client
    bridge), so you must be doing something else you're not telling us. Are
    you actually doing something in the Senao #1 management interface? Is
    that management interface configured to get an address from the remote
    service by DHCP? Or are you configuring it manually?
    When that happens, try power cycling it.

    It sounds like the signal from the open site ('sailing router'?) is poor
    (at least as received by Senao #1). Do you have a good, solid antenna
    connection on Senao #1? Does it report signal strength? (I don't care
    what the Hawking says.)
    My suggestion is to concentrate on getting Senao #1 to work properly
    when wired to your computer. Nothing else. Repeat: nothing else.
     
    John Navas, Jul 7, 2006
    #10
  11. Like a bad penny....

    John Navas wrote:

    LOL ROFL

    That, up until my very fleeting success a couple nights ago, is all I'd
    hoped for. A year's worth of trying has yet to succeed.

    I'm in a short break between rebedding and downpours; tonight I'm off
    to a Ham club meeting, so I may not be able do do the stuff mentioned
    in this post. I downloaded what I thought was the was the correct
    firmware, and this unit is configurable for the world (europe, japan,
    US, etc., are all specified in the channel designatoins - and since I
    may be in some of those, I expect I should leave it so.).

    However, I gather I don't have the 'deluxe' unit (at least based on the
    information on the board). That's the current firmware I have
    downloaded. I'm not sure what the vendor sent me (but the unit reports
    the same firmware versions as the readme tells me to find). I'll do
    another web search to see if I can find a better download - but you'd
    previously instructed me not to reflash before reporting back.

    So, another question: reflash or not before doing your new set of
    stuff?

    Thanks.

    L8R

    Skip
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 7, 2006
    #11
  12. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    You should configure it for USA only.
    What I actually said is that you could skip the flash, but only because
    you said you didn't have the proper firmware.
    I'd much rather have you flash the correct latest firmware before doing
    anything else. After flashing, reset the unit back to factory defaults,
    and then carefully configure for client bridge mode only, reporting all
    of the exact settings you make here.
     
    John Navas, Jul 7, 2006
    #12
  13. Hi, John, and list,

    Some things I have learned:

    I do indeed have 2611CB3 Plus Deluxe units (there was some question as
    to whether I had "Deluxe" or just "Plus" units. They reliably toggle
    between AP and Bridge (toggle meaning I can switch from one to
    another), which is what defines Deluxe or not, I've discovered. The
    base configuration is AP but they can also be configured as bridge.

    They have the current firmware for both configurations.

    These are international units. Configuring for USA only *may* be
    possible, but I don't know how - and in any event, it doesn't matter,
    first, as one isn't likely to find some non-US channel here, and,
    second, when I'm in another part of the world, I may need the
    additional channels.

    They don't like anyone else anywhere nearby talking on the same
    netblock. Whether 192 or 10, I've discovered that there are APs in
    those ranges, and whether it's where the IP conflicts originated, I
    can't say with any assurance. I can only say that using either of
    those netblocks produced IP conflicts. At the moment I seem to have a
    stable configuration using the 172 netblock.

    "sailing router" is the name of one of the SSIDs (there are two with
    that same name which show up in my Hawking adapter scans - the outfit
    to which they belong have named both their routers 'sailing router') to
    which I have normally connected, successfully. However, getting the
    2611s to connect to the "sailing router" connection seems to be very
    difficult, if not impossible, for whatever reason(s). My Hawking
    adapter
    (http://www.hawkingtech.com/products/productlist.php?CatID=33&FamID=102&ProdID=127)
    sees and selects from many different APs, among them the two "sailing
    router" (with different macs), currently 4 different "linksys" and many
    other. I can successfully associate my Hawking adapter with perhaps
    4-6 open sites on a good day, such as today. Right now, using the
    space for SSID specification, I can only associate with something other
    than "sailing router" - specifically, the strongest of the "linksys"
    currently visible - on the 2611. Given that the APs visible are the
    same on the 2611 or the Hawking units, at the same apparent level of
    communication quality, I don't have any idea what's up with that. In
    any event, I'm currently connected over one of the linksys APs visible,
    as I can't successfully specify and connect to 'sailing router'.

    I am letting this sit and trying to break it (well, using it, power
    cycling it, seeing if it will remain associated with linksys and stay
    up). Once I've established its stability, I'll come back and go
    through the tests and report back on the series of things you wanted me
    to do.

    Right now, I don't want to rock the boat (pardon the expression), so I
    hope you'll excuse me. However, the foregoing is background for the
    time when I do the tests you've laid out, and answered some of the
    questions you had. And, FWIW, I started with both units (re)set to
    factory defaults before doing my tests which got me to this point.

    L8R

    Skip


    Morgan 461 #2
    SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
    See our galleries at http://justpickone.org/skip/gallery/

    "Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
    nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
    messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
    In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
    that's the charm of it.
    Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
    destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
    get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
    particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
    do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 16, 2006
    #13
  14. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    Makes no sense. Your Senao won't see IP addresses in a wireless network
    unless it's both associated and connected.
    Probably some other problem, or maybe you were connecting and didn't
    know it. Switching may simply be masking a problem, which may still be
    an issue. Better to figure out what's really going on and fix it.
    I've already explained why the Hawking and Senao aren't comparable.
     
    John Navas, Jul 20, 2006
    #14
  15. Hi, John,

    About to leave the boat to pack up the remaining stuff and move Lydia
    aboard, too.

    Just one quickie clarification:

    I wasn't trying to say they were comparable. You'd wanted to know what
    adapter I was using when I couldn't make the senaos work, and to have
    me use proper terminology. I had thought the Hawking was a USB wifi
    adapter. If that's wrong, perhaps I'll continue to triangulate until I
    get it right..

    I'm just using the Hawking (whatever it is which gets me internet
    access from my laptop, via an AP labeled 'sailing router' on its SSID)
    results as a reference point. If the Hawking can see it when it scans,
    and the senao unit sees it when *it* scans (SSID line left blank is the
    only way it does), and I can connect it via Hawking, but not senao, I
    presume there's a problem.

    BICBW - so far I'm batting 1.000...

    L8R

    Skip
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 20, 2006
    #15
  16. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    <http://groups.google.com/group/alt.internet.wireless/msg/b96169ed0ac01a1d>:

    I'm guessing the Hawking is a "g" client. (I don't know for sure
    because you've never clearly identified it.) The Senao is a "b"
    client. You *can't* compare them directly unless you put the Hawking
    in "b-only" mode.
    Not necessarily, as I've tried to explain.
     
    John Navas, Jul 20, 2006
    #16
  17. Hi again...

    Ah....

    Could that be the root of my challenges WRT connectivity? That a
    g-enabled unit could talk to something a b could not?

    As to identification, the URL I gave you for the Hawking unit wasn't
    sufficient?

    So, back to the story, some time ago (don't remember for sure when or
    in what context) you commented about preferring a g-enabled unit. I
    don't recall the specifics of why you preferred those, but this
    particular point has me wondering:

    Would there be APs which "speak" only g, and not b? I would have
    thought them backward compatible, but, maybe not.

    OTOH, as much as these senao units are supported by those who have them
    figured out, I'd have expected them not to have this (assuming that's
    what's going on) problem. And, their literature proclaims the
    superiority of transmission/reception on b over g. At any rate, as
    above, perhaps that's why I can "get" stations with the Hawking and -
    even though they show up in a scan, at the same strengths - not with
    the senao?

    And, this has scratched my curiosity, so I just went topsides and
    looked - I was mistaken - they just *looked* alike. What I have is a
    [HWU54D]
    (http://www.hawkingtech.com//support/details.php?CatID=19&FamID=33&ProdID=176&Rev=Orig),
    which is, indeed, a g unit. What I'd thought I'd had (the URL I
    provided) was an antenna and adapter in the same unit, and looked just
    like what I have (which I assume is the same configuration, giving it
    the 6dBi and acting as an adapter as well).

    Of course, I still have to kill the IP conflict dragon, but this
    exchange makes me wonder if my inability to connect some stations has
    to do with b or g issues...

    Thanks for sticking with me. My ability (since gone the way of IP
    conflicts, again) to actually communicate with/through them gives me
    hope that I can, after all, make them work...

    L8R

    Skip
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 21, 2006
    #17
  18. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    (802.11)"g" has different range and other characteristics than "b".
    You're comparing oranges and tangerines.
    What URL? You've posted so much stuff I've missed it. [scanning down]
    Ah, HWU54D, which is indeed a "g" unit.
    Better range and weak signal characteristics than "b" units.
    All "g" units I know of can speak "b" as well, but many (most?) can be
    configured as "auto" (b+g), "g only", and "b only". I've encountered
    access points configured as "g only", apparently to avoid degradation
    from "b" clients.
    Beware marketingspeak, but out of curiosity, link please. Do you mean
    <http://www.senao-me.com/products-details.asp?CatId=3&SubCatId=5&SubCat2Id=1&SubCat3Id=1&ProdId=19>?
    * We know it's marketingspeak right off because of silliness like:
    64 /128-bit WEP data encryption - Powerful data security
    * Hide SSID - Avoids unallowable users sharing bandwidth, increases
    efficiency of the network
    * MAC address filtering - Ensures secure network connection
    But I don't see anything on "b" being better than "g".
    Perhaps. Try the Hawking in "b only" mode.
    Should be easy if you carefully follow my step-by-step instructions.
    Could be.
    I'm fairly sure they can be made to work if configured properly.
     
    John Navas, Jul 21, 2006
    #18
  19. Skip - Working on the boat

    John Navas Guest

    The "g" version is the SL 3054CB3+ Deluxe (with WPA and WDS support)
    <http://www.senao-me.com/products-details.asp?CatId=3&SubCatId=5&SubCat2Id=1&SubCat3Id=1&ProdId=20>
    Claimed range is the same as the SL 2611CB3+ Deluxe.

    Firmware and manuals are downloadable from those web pages.
     
    John Navas, Jul 21, 2006
    #19
  20. Hi, John, and group...

    Just about to turn the key to drive off 600 miles to "home" (the boat
    is my home, but Lydia and the tiny remainder of stuff is up there), so
    just one clarification:

    Here's the link:
    http://www.interprojekt.com.pl/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=11&products_id=29
    This is the specific quote:

    802.11b (11 Mbps) is much more robust over links longer than about 3km
    than 802.11g (54 Mbps). There are a number of reasons for this;

    * 802.11g is much more affected by multi-path reflections than
    802.11b. Reflections can come of buildings, water, hills, ...
    * 802.11g spreads the power over a number of sub-channels meaning
    the power in each sub-channel is less than 802.11b. This reduces the
    range.

    Gotta run. More as I'm able...

    L8R

    Skip

    Morgan 461 #2
    SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
    See our galleries at http://justpickone.org/skip/gallery/

    "Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
    nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
    messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
    In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
    that's the charm of it.
    Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
    destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
    get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
    particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
    do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."
     
    Skip - Working on the boat, Jul 21, 2006
    #20
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