MN740 & WPA (Chris - any thoughts)

Gang,

It seems a shame that the MN740 doesn't support WPA-PSK (at the moment it
only supports the weaker 64/128 WEP standard). My network consists of the
MN820 wireless G kit and the MN740. My home computer (XP Pro SP2) is wired
directly to the MN700 and I use the PCM card for my work laptop. I am forced
to use the flimsy WEP for my encryption because of the limitations of the
MN740. I am in the process of putting a new computer on my network that will
be connected via a PCI Wireless G card, but again, I'll have to settle for
WEP.

I think the issue that has me a little animated regarding this subject is
the new DLink game adapter (see links below). It has all the advantages of
the MN740 + WPA-PSK... and it looks exactly like the MN740 (I guess maybe
they make it for Microsoft). It even has hooks into the XBOX dashboard,
which is the only advantage the MN740 had over the competitors.

When MS released the MN740 it was the newest one on the market to support
802.11G, but didn't support WPA even though the standard did exist. I
thought for sure (and everyone else did on this newsgroup) they would
release a firmware update to support WPA. I know that MS has stopped
manufacturing their line of wireless products EXCEPT the MN740. If they had
stopped making and selling this I could understand them not being interested
in adding this feature, but they are still selling it.

I'm not sure if there are technical limitations in distributing a firmware
release to support the WPA standard to a piece of hardware that extends the
XBOX functionality. I guess they would have to patch the dashboard to
support the new option and that could be problematic because not everyone
that has the MN740 uses it to connect to XBOX Live. This would force MS
offer some sort of CD to update the dashboard - obviously complicating
matters.

I guess I needed to vent ;-) I'm not a MS basher - in fact I owe my
livelihood to MS as I am a programmer and use their tools almost
exclusively, but I really would like to understand this issue better.

Thanks reading my rant ;-)

Jim

New DGL-3420 info...
Picture: ftp://ftp10.dlink.com/images/products/DGL-3420/DGL-3420.jpg
Specs: http://games.dlink.com/products/?pid=383

 

Jim, I agree in your venting on the lack of WPA support on the MN-740. That
device came from the Xbox side of the hardware house at Microsoft, and not
the now-defunct networking hardware team which created the regular computer
routers/base stations and adapters which were dropped by Microsoft last
spring.

That said, putting WPA on the MN-740 - as I understand it - would require a
different hardware configuration or chip, not just the Xbox Dashboard setup
as you suggest. So I seriously doubt any "update" for the MN-740 software
will be forthcoming in the hardware area.

 

Slight correction here. The MN-740 does run the Atheros chip, like the new
D-Link
DGL-3420. However, I still would not look for a software update enabling
WPA from the Microsoft folks.

 

And that is very sad. I mean why would you degrade all of the security in
your house for an Xbox? My current Xbox wireless setup is running the
prorietary 256 dlink encryption with no degredation in performance. I don't
see how WPA 256bit could be that worse.

I'm soon switching to an MN-700, and it chaps my hide that MS doesn't
include WPA support for the 740, otherwise I'd be buying another product
from them. For now I'm going to find another vendor for the WPA bridge to
the Xbox, and that is unacceptable.

 

I agree, but there isn't anything as a user like you I can do except
complain via the Microsoft Wish program:
http://register.microsoft.com/mswish/suggestion.asp

However, since you've mentioned adding another router to your system you CAN
segment the Xbox device off on its own portion of your LAN so it is isolated
from the "important" stuff.

Check out Microsoft MVP Barb Bowman's article regarding this subject on the
Expert Zone:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/using/networking/expert/bowman_segnet.mspx

 

I'm glad to see that others feel the same way. Thanks for the input... maybe
I'll enter something in the suggestion box. What are the odds that anyone
looks at that and, if they do, that anyone will care. I know... very
pessimistic, but I guess one never knows until you try ;-)

This news group is always filled with the "it doesn't work" stories, and
rightly so. But this one is more like "It works good, but would be great if
only MS would extend their recent security focus to their wireless
products". MS should know that this leaves the home network very vulnerable
and is as important as blocking spyware and viruses, which they seem very
focused on given XP SP2, their accusation of Giant for AntiSpyware, their
upcoming beta for an AntiVirus, etc.

I just would like to see a company step up to the plate and say, "hey - we
know there is a significant (in this case security) gap in what this product
provides and we'd like to fix it".

Again, this topic is just cathartic in nature. It feels good to express the
frustration and have others agree.

Jim

 

Remember, this newsgroup is peer support. The MVPs you see posting here do
so voluntarily, on their own time. When the Broadband Networking products
first came out, there were Microsoft hardware folks here nearly on a daily
basis, but that division was dropped at Microsoft. The MN-740 comes of the
Xbox side of the house, was never actively supported here officially, and I
believe one needs to be a Master Chief to have access to those folks.

 

Well, for me it is justthe fact i flatout feel denied. I
love the product as it works well. And what chaps my
hide about it is this little quote that can be found on
the product information page for the mn-740:

"Upgradeable for future security features."
found here under High Security:
http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/broadbandnetworking/prod
uctdetails.aspx?pid=015#

to me, that says they had plans to do it, and for the
better part left us high and dry....and more importantly,
unsecure....


Tim

 

I agree, Tim. We all want the best security on our LANs, and it is more
necessary is some residential areas than others. However, there is a way to
get around it as I posted previously, to segment your LAN to isolate the
Xbox, and provide higher security for your computers. What can anyone do
accessing your Xbox?

 

Since I first wrote about segmenting WEP segments, things have changed
in the security world. It's no longer safe to have a WEP only segment
on the same network under most conditions. A new column on wireless
zecurity reflecting today's frames of references will be up very soon
on the Expert Zone.

I've replaced my MN-740s with DLink DWL-G820's which offer WPA. I've
removed all WEP only devices from my network.

 

There isn't much they can do to the Xbox, but the fact
that it is passing the WEP key gives hackers a window
into your network. By dropping having to drop down to
WEP for the Xbox, you are exposing your entire network.
Having to segment off the network is an expensive and
unnecessary kludge thanks to Microsoft dropping the ball.

Everyone write in the wish list link provided and demand
WPA. It takes several voices and this isn't rocket
science to implement.