FTTC router installation query

Discussion in 'Broadband' started by Andy Blanchard, Jul 19, 2014.

  1. So, FTTC has finally arrived at my local cab. and, needless to say, I'll
    be upgrading from my current DSL service. AFAIK, the process is that
    the engineer installs a new faceplate and attaches the FTTC modem to it,
    then I plug my router into that via a CAT6 patch cable. Simples.

    The snag is that where the cable from the cabinet comes into the house
    and the main faceplate is located isn't a great location for a router,
    let alone two. Currently, I have the DSL splitter and router hung off a
    second phone socket spurred off the main one and located near power and
    in a good spot for a wireless base station, which all works great,
    giving me ~98% of max theoretical speeds.

    My question is, can the FTTC modem be installed at the secondary socket,
    or does it have to go on the primary, which would require I install a
    new power socket and a CAT6 cable run before the FTTC install?

    Thanks in advance,
    Andy
     
    Andy Blanchard, Jul 19, 2014
    #1
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  2. Andy Blanchard

    Roger Mills Guest

    I assume that it would need to be plugged into the master socket
    position. Have you got anything plugged in to the current master
    position? If not, how difficult would it be to swap positions - moving
    the master socket to where you want the comms equipment.

    This may depend on your wiring layout, and whether or not you've got
    lots of extension wiring fanning out from the current master position -
    which would make things more difficult. Even then, with a bit if
    ingenuity, if there's a 2 (or more) pair cable between current and new
    master positions, you should be able to use one pair to carry the
    incoming pair (joined at the back of the socket with jelly crimps) up to
    the new master, and another pair to carry the analog extension wiring
    back to the first position.

    That's basically how my house is wired - albeit ADSL rather than FTTC -
    but I don't see why it wouldn't work.

    Whether you do the re-jigging yourself prior to installation day, or
    bribe the engineer to do it is your choice.
    --
    Cheers,
    Roger
    ____________
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    checked.
     
    Roger Mills, Jul 19, 2014
    #2
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  3. Andy Blanchard

    David Guest

    "Andy Blanchard" wrote in message

    So, FTTC has finally arrived at my local cab. and, needless to say, I'll
    be upgrading from my current DSL service. AFAIK, the process is that
    the engineer installs a new faceplate and attaches the FTTC modem to it,
    then I plug my router into that via a CAT6 patch cable. Simples.

    The snag is that where the cable from the cabinet comes into the house
    and the main faceplate is located isn't a great location for a router,
    let alone two. Currently, I have the DSL splitter and router hung off a
    second phone socket spurred off the main one and located near power and
    in a good spot for a wireless base station, which all works great,
    giving me ~98% of max theoretical speeds.

    My question is, can the FTTC modem be installed at the secondary socket,
    or does it have to go on the primary, which would require I install a
    new power socket and a CAT6 cable run before the FTTC install?

    Thanks in advance,
    Andy


    ==============================================================

    Andy,

    FYI I have just gone through the process of moving to FTTC.

    BT/Openreach will replace your existing master socket with a new unit. This
    has two sockets - the standard BT phone socket - and an RJ-11 socket into
    which the BT/Openreach FTTC modem directly plugs. The new master socket
    contains an adsl filter so you won't need your existing adsl filter at the
    master. Don't throw your adsl filters away, you will still need to use them
    for phones at any other secondary sockets.

    The FTTC modem needs to be plugged into this new master socket, not one of
    the secondary sockets.

    In my case my master socket is installed at the point where the BT cable
    enters the house and this is where I have the FTTC modem located so I didn't
    have your dilemma. However, I believe that the master socket can be
    installed at any of your existing socket locations, but you'll need to check
    with the BT/Openreach installer.

    Hope this helps.

    Regards

    David
     
    David, Jul 20, 2014
    #3
  4. Andy Blanchard

    Andy Burns Guest

    Has to be the master socket, but (depending on what your ISP has ordered
    via OpenReach) the engineer's visit may include the cost of relocating
    the master socket and turning the previous master into a secondary,
    within distance limits.

    For the installation visit, it's simplest to have the modem and router
    adjacent to the master socket, but you could move the router to a
    location that's better (e.g. for WiFi coverage or to connect existing
    Ethernet wiring) after the install is complete.
     
    Andy Burns, Jul 20, 2014
    #4
  5. Andy Blanchard

    PeeGee Guest

    It is possible to request an "extension" cable be fitted during
    installation - basically up to 30m of Cat5e from the master socket (a/b
    IDC connectors on the interstitial plate, RJ11 crimped for modem) to the
    required location of the modem, usually stapled to the skirting, though
    you could install an unterminated length in readiness. Unfortunately,
    the modem connector is RJ11 though the master socket connector is RJ45,
    so a standard patch lead will not fit.

    --
    PeeGee

    "Nothing should be able to load itself onto a computer without the
    knowledge or consent of the computer user. Software should also be able
    to be removed from a computer easily."
    Peter Cullen, Microsoft Chief Privacy Strategist (Computing 18 Aug 05)
     
    PeeGee, Jul 20, 2014
    #5
  6. Andy Blanchard

    David Guest

    No engineer came to my house.
    My new ISP sent me a new box to replace the ADSL router.
    On transfer day when the ADSL went off I swapped the boxes over and was on
    VSDL at high speed after about 36 hours later the speed dropped a little
    after the DLM had decided the best speed for my line.
    Only alteration I made was to change my master sockets filtered faceplate to
    a Mark 2 version. I believe this not really necessary but I feel better
    having done so.

    Regards
    David
     
    David, Jul 20, 2014
    #6
  7. Andy Blanchard

    Roger Mills Guest

    Are you *sure*? The device which you describe above sounds very similar
    to the sort of filtered faceplate used on many ADSL installations - in
    which case I would expect it to have filtered IDC connections on the
    back to which extension wire could be connected such that extension
    sockets are then automatically filtered without needing plug-in filters.
    Is this not the case?
    --
    Cheers,
    Roger
    ____________
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    checked.
     
    Roger Mills, Jul 20, 2014
    #7
  8. No you won't. The new master faceplate has two sockets, one for the
    VDSL modem, and one for phones. The phone socket is the standard BT
    type you already use for phones and extension cables, and is filtered
    in the box, so you won't need any additional filtering anywhere. You
    won't need your ADSL filters ever again.

    The master socket is now the only one into which you can plug a VDSL
    modem. You can't just choose an extension as you could with ADSL, so
    you need to decide where you want the master socket to be installed.
    The phone cable from outside will need to go directly to the master
    socket and will not be connected to anything else along the way.

    Rod.
     
    Roderick Stewart, Jul 20, 2014
    #8
  9. Andy Blanchard

    Flop Guest

    Decide what you want:

    a) ideally
    b) on the assumption that the engineer will swap faceplates in situ.

    Then, when the engineer arrives, offer tea/coffee and biscuits and tell
    him what your fairy godmother would do.

    Most BTOR engineers are very [,very] helpful and may assist in minor
    relocation [especially if H&S is involved - eg cables under carpets are
    frowned upon].

    Hope you are lucky!
     
    Flop, Jul 20, 2014
    #9
  10. Andy Blanchard

    Andy Burns Guest

    Incorrect.
     
    Andy Burns, Jul 20, 2014
    #10
  11. Andy Blanchard

    David Guest

    "Andy Burns" wrote in message

    Incorrect.

    ======================================================

    So I gather from the other posts - I asked the installer if I still needed
    the filters and he said yes for any extension phone - seems like I got duff
    info.

    David
     
    David, Jul 20, 2014
    #11
  12. Yes. If that's really what he said, it's duff info. The socket on the
    new VDSL master faceplate to which you would plug any extension wiring
    is already filtered.

    Rod.
     
    Roderick Stewart, Jul 20, 2014
    #12
  13. Andy Blanchard

    Graham. Guest

    Worse than that, you may have got a duff installation also.
    Any extension sockets should be wired to the filtered side of the new
    VDSL faceplate, no additional filters are required (although they
    won't do any harm).
     
    Graham., Jul 20, 2014
    #13
  14. Andy Blanchard

    Graham. Guest


    Oh dear, self install VDSL, seems to be becoming common with the
    budget ISPs.

    At least you already have a central faceplate filter, so things could
    be a lot worse.

    What is the history of this faceplate, did you install it yourself?

    Which one is it? Can you provide a link to this Mk 2 version, is it
    specifically for VDSL?
     
    Graham., Jul 20, 2014
    #14
  15. Andy Blanchard

    David Guest

    "Graham." wrote in message

    Worse than that, you may have got a duff installation also.
    Any extension sockets should be wired to the filtered side of the new
    VDSL faceplate, no additional filters are required (although they
    won't do any harm).

    =====================================================

    In my life I've found that if something can be done incorrectly - it
    probably will.

    But my upload/download speeds are exactly as expected, so things can't be
    too far astray.
     
    David, Jul 20, 2014
    #15
  16. Andy Blanchard

    Jim Guest

    You need to supply the OR engineer with a router
    as well?
     
    Jim, Jul 20, 2014
    #16
  17. Andy Blanchard

    Andy Burns Guest

    Depends on the ISP, some will expect you to supply your own, for testing
    you could simply connect *one* PC to the modem using PPPoE.
     
    Andy Burns, Jul 20, 2014
    #17
  18. Andy Blanchard

    David Guest

    "David" wrote in message

    However, I believe that the master socket can be
    installed at any of your existing socket locations, but you'll need to check
    with the BT/Openreach installer.

    =======================================================

    I've just had a look at the internals of my new master socket, and you may
    not be able to use an existing secondary socket location for your new master
    socket.

    On the new style master socket, the incoming exchange pair is terminated on
    one set of IDC connectors, and the cable to the secondary sockets is taken
    from a separate set of IDC connectors. This means that you will need two
    cables running to the new master socket location (or a single cable with an
    adequate number of cores so that you can keep the incoming BT pairs separate
    from you house wiring).

    The old type of master socket contained a capacitor which was connected to a
    separate core for the ringers in the phones, so you needed a cable with a
    minimum of three cores running from the master socket to all the secondary
    sockets. However the incoming exchange pair used to be available at all
    secondary sockets which made replacing any secondary socket with an old
    style master socket feasible.

    Hope this helps and sorry for the confusion

    David
     
    David, Jul 21, 2014
    #18
  19. Andy Blanchard

    Roger Mills Guest

    I don't think that's right.
    That's what I would expect. The incoming pair is unfiltered, and is used
    directly for the broadband connection. The other connections are filtered.
    You only actually need two *pairs* - one for the incoming and one for
    the filtered extension wiring.
    Yes, but few modern phones actually need the third wire, and can
    generate their own ring signal. If you have one that doesn't, then
    connecting it via a plug-in ADSL filter (otherwise un-needed) does the
    trick. You're well rid of the third wire because - being unbalanced - it
    can pick up interference which reduces the stability of the broadband.
    --
    Cheers,
    Roger
    ____________
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    checked.
     
    Roger Mills, Jul 21, 2014
    #19
  20. Andy Blanchard

    Jim Guest

    I thought the Open Reach installer/engineer would
    only connect the BT modem, check that it worked using
    some test equipment then make a quick getaway.
     
    Jim, Jul 21, 2014
    #20
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