Broadband on some sockets but not others

Discussion in 'Broadband' started by Bunty, Feb 24, 2011.

  1. Bunty

    Bunty Guest

    I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky fo
    phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots o
    phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I hav
    identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. Howeve
    only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
    Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room
    pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built i
    ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The othe
    set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with an
    without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in th
    lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.

    My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And mor
    importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other socket
    - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it
     
    Bunty, Feb 24, 2011
    #1
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  2. Bunty

    Andy Champ Guest

    Hi Bunty,

    the one with the built in filter is quite likely the master socket, and
    filters ADSL signals out before they get to the other ones. If that's a
    BT master socket I think you have a problem - real money to move it.
    Think about using a wireless connection into the lounge, or a network
    cable with the router near the master socket.

    Others who know more will be along later.

    Andy
     
    Andy Champ, Feb 24, 2011
    #2
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  3. Most likely the non broadband sockets are provisioned from the filtered
    or "phone only" side of whichever socket has the built in filtering.

    The answer to both your questions is yes.

    Filters go between the exchange - adsl modem connection and the telephone.

    (Yes, I know some filters are more complex than this)

    With a hard wired filter, what you get is something like this:

    Exchange <--X--+--> adsl modem
    |
    [Filter]
    |
    +--> phone 1
    |
    +--> phone 2
    |
    +--> phone 3
    |
    +--> phone 4
    |
    +--> phone 5

    The filter and adsl modem socket and phone 1 socket may be incorporated
    in a single item.

    X is the master socket. It can be combined with the filter, phone 1 and
    adsl modem sockets.

    With microfilters, you get something more like this:

    Exchange <--X--+--> adsl modem
    |
    +--> [microfilter] <--> phone 1
    |
    +--> [microfilter] <--> phone 2
    |
    +--> [microfilter] <--> phone 3
    |
    +--> [microfilter] <--> phone 4
    |
    +--> [microfilter] <--> phone 5

    (Yes, I know you may use a microfilter to connect your RJ11 adsl modem
    plug to the BT 431A socket, but it's not actually doing any filtering
    when you do that, it's just acting as a converter from BT431A to RJ11)

    What you need to do is configure your internal wiring so that:

    (a) There is a single unbroken length of at least telephone grade
    twisted pair between the master socket X and the filter.

    (b) If needed, there is a single unbroken length of at least telephone
    grade twisted pair between the unfiltered side of the filter and the
    socket you wish to plug your adsl into. (If possible, relocate the
    filter to the location that you wish to connect the dsl, so that this is
    not needed!)

    (c) The sockets that you wish to use for telephony are connected in
    parallel on the filtered side of the filter.

    Any extraneous connections between the master socket and the filter, or
    between the filter and the adsl modem, will degrade the adsl signal. The
    more connections and teed off spurs you have, the worse it will be. This
    is why, if you can, it is better to use a single master filter rather
    than a microfilter on each phone.

    Rgds

    Denis McMahon
     
    Denis McMahon, Feb 24, 2011
    #3
  4. Either the sockets have filters in the master (e.g. NTE5 or 5A) or one
    downstream has a sub plate and only passes filtered.

    You need to identify where this is happening and replace it with a plain
    vanilla face plate(s), you will then need plug in filter(s).

    Might be best to keep the router where the BT line enters the house and run
    Cat5e cable to where you need service.
     
    R. Mark Clayton, Feb 24, 2011
    #4
  5. Bunty

    Woody Guest



    Two possibilites.

    The sockets on which you cannot get broadband have been wired
    with other than twisted-pair solid wire telephone cable. If they
    have been wired with flat parallel or burglar alarm cable then
    the RF that carries the broadband will be lost very quickly.

    Technically you should not have a REN of more than 4 on a single
    telephone line and since most phones have a REN of 1 (ringing
    equivalence number) and you have at least five sockets, is it
    possible there is a ringing booster hidden away somewhere? These
    are notorious for being broadband blockers.

    A final thought: if you have sockets that don't work, did the
    previous occupant have cable phone as a second line - if you are
    in a cabled area - which has been ceased?
     
    Woody, Feb 24, 2011
    #5
  6. Bunty

    Roger Mills Guest

    Are you sure that you've only got one phone line, rather than two - with
    ADSL enabled on only one of them? [If you plug a phone into each socket
    in turn, and dial 17070, do they all report the same phone number?]

    Assuming that there *is* only one line, it sounds like you've got a
    filtered faceplate similar to
    http://www.clarity.it/xcart/home.php?cat=262 [1] in your master socket,
    which filters all the extension wiring to separate the phones from the
    ADSL signal. If this is the case, ADSL will only work when you plug your
    modem/router into the ADSL outlet on the filtered faceplate.

    If it's a fairly recent filtered faceplace, it will probably have a pair
    of unfiltered terminals on the back, in addition to the filtered
    terminals to which your extension wiring is connected. In this case,
    what you need to do run an unfiltered extension cable from those
    terminals to the point where you want to connect your ADSL equipment,
    and terminate it with an RJ11[2] socket rather than a normal BT socket.

    [1] It would help to be sure if you could upload a photo of any
    socket(s) where ADSL *does* work, and post a link here.
    [2] You'll see one if you scroll down the page in the Clarity link, above
    --
    Cheers,
    Roger
    ____________
    Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
    checked.
     
    Roger Mills, Feb 24, 2011
    #6
  7. Bunty

    John Weston Guest

    That's a common set-up. As others have said, it sounds like you have a
    master socket either in your home office or you haven't yet found it.
    This has an "ADSL filter" that removes the ADSL signal from the phone-
    type connections, including those for devices with old analog modems in
    them. One of your slave sockets is connected to the unfiltered side so
    the ADSL router can be installed remotely from the master socket. There
    are a couple of punch-down connections on the back of the faceplate,
    normally labelled "A" and "B" used to extend the ADSL-carrying wiring,
    (The phone only wiring is on 3 connections 2, 3 and 5, where "3" is the
    bell wire that can be disconnected when using modern phones, which may
    improve the ADSL performance.)

    The only thing to remember is if you connect a non-ADSL device in the
    home office, you have to use plug-in micro filters or equivalent in the
    ADSL-carrying sockets, if the socket there doesn't have both BT and RJ
    sockets.

    You can extend the ADSL-carrying wiring to another socket remote from the
    master by transferring the wiring going to that socket from 2 and 5 to A
    and B, PROVIDING there are no more than 2 wires already in the A and B
    connectors.

    If you want to do a proper job, filter all the phone sockets at the
    master, so you have no ADSL on any of your phone wiring and plug in your
    router directly into the Master's "ADSL" socket. Then install a CAT5E
    cable network to separately installed RJ45 Ethernet sockets where needed.
    This will be good for a 1Gb LAN network, if you install a Gb switch at
    the star point where all your CAT5E cables are routed. (Ethernet sockets
    can't be connected in parallel) If you have to install the router
    remotely from the master socket, replace its RJ11 cable with a long,
    screened twisted-pair type so you can still plug it into the master
    socket (see www.adslnation.com shop).

    Be warned that an old house may have interior wall construction that
    partly screens each room from the Wireless network signals so a wired
    network of some sort may be your only solution.
     
    John Weston, Feb 24, 2011
    #7
  8. Bunty

    Bunty Guest

    Many thanks John - and everyone else who replied. All very useful info
    and I am now much clearer about what my options are. Cheers All!
     
    Bunty, Feb 25, 2011
    #8
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