Another great example of the Linux community in action: NOT! (Was: Linux networking is a ball of con

Discussion in 'Linux Networking' started by Kevin Pederson, Oct 1, 2004.

  1. It's a pretty sad testament to the Linux community to see all the hate and
    venum vented on that poor poster. Are Linux users so insecure with their
    own selves that they can't understand that not everyone is an expert and
    that people sometimes get frustrated? It really makes me ashamed to say I
    am a Linux user because personally I have no desire to be included with
    the likes of people like those who attacked that poster.

    Much of what he says is true and is evidenced by the number of Samba
    questions asked in this group over and over again. Something is surely
    wrong if the same topic comes up all the time. Did anyone bother to ask if
    he was running a stock install where Samba was broken? If he hasn't
    updated it may never work for him and it may not be his fault. Personally
    I would tell him to stay with Suse 9.0 because 9.1 is far to buggy Well
    that's my say on it, flame away but I could care less as I prefer to help
    people instead of attacking them.

    Kevin Pederson
     
    Kevin Pederson, Oct 1, 2004
    #1
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  2. Kevin Pederson

    Dave Uhring Guest

    Then why did you not help that whining luser?
     
    Dave Uhring, Oct 1, 2004
    #2
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  3. Kevin Pederson

    Andy Fraser Guest

    In alt.os.linux, Kevin Pederson uttered these immortal words:
    I kept clear of that thread but I think I can understand why some people
    were less than friendly. The poster started with:

    <quote>
    Why is simple P2P networking such a mess with Linux?
    Microsoft and Windows seem to be able to sort this out and make it work in
    a simple, reasonable manner that doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure
    out so why can't Linux do the same?
    </quote>

    Does that sound like something a troll might say? It did to me so I skipped
    to the next thread. Given that some others might've read that as trolling
    I'm not surprised that those people responded the way they did.
    I think there are far too many people coming to Linux from Windows who want
    to run before they can walk. Some people with network or network service
    related problems freely admit that they know nothing about networks or the
    service they're trying to run.

    Things may work in the Windows world by starting a service and just fumbling
    around a few dialog boxes but the Linux equivalents generally require a
    higher level of knowledge and an ability to read and understand the many
    docs that exist among other skills.

    I think the bottom line is if Linux is particularly hard for someone to
    learn then they need to ask themselves whether it's right for them for what
    they want to do. It won't be right for everyone just as Windows isn't right
    for a lot of us.

    I'm sure some people want to come to Linux because they think they're going
    to get something for nothing. They're wrong. It'll cost them time to learn
    the new skills they'll need. Some people don't seem to want to invest that
    time.

    IMHO of course.
     
    Andy Fraser, Oct 1, 2004
    #3
  4. Kevin Pederson

    Dan C Guest

    "Poor poster"? He came in here bitching and basically saying "it's all
    Linux's fault!" He got exactly what he was looking for.
    So why didn't you help him?
     
    Dan C, Oct 1, 2004
    #4
  5. Kevin Pederson

    ynotssor Guest

    It's a"pretty sad testament" that you can't include the pertinent quoted
    text so that people have some idea of what you're even talking about.
     
    ynotssor, Oct 1, 2004
    #5
  6. Kevin Pederson

    filesiteguy Guest

    Kevin Pederson scratched out in the sand

    Then why are you posting this flamebait article?
     
    filesiteguy, Oct 1, 2004
    #6
  7. Kevin Pederson

    7 Guest

    But madam, why so much flatness? Is M$ paying you direct with
    instructions now?
    The issue is not GNU/Linux - the issue is that it is windopes
    which mucks things up. I've got samba working perfectly in GNU/Linux
    boxes, but can I get it to work fully with windopes? No. Can windopes
    work? No. Not if there are firewalls and other things in the way.
    The protocol which samba has to use to support the microshaft crap
    is hideos in detail.

    For GNU/Linux at least, there is a quick alternative.
    enter the following to start the ssh server, and the second command
    to make it start at boot time.

    /etc/init.d/ssh start
    update-rc.d ssh defaults

    Now if you have KDE loaded, open conqueror and enter in the URL

    fish://[email protected]

    and voila, it asks for password, and you are logged into remote machine
    with the given ipaddress, with
    similar functionality to windopes samba networking with the
    added bonus that the traffic is sent encrypted because fish uses ssh.
    You can read and write files as per permissions set for the user.
    You can change permissions by opening up a console and
    entering

    ssh [email protected]

    and log into remote machines again through encrypted session.
    You can then type away as if you are sitting in front of the
    remote machine and do anthing you like. If you want to shut
    the machine down for example, it would be

    shutdown -h now

    If you want to run up a vnc session, you would type

    vncserver :1 -geometry 1024x768

    and voila you have another session of KDE running, which
    you can connect to using RDesktop in KDE by typing in
    the location

    ipaddress:1

    and voila, you have complete graphical duplication
    of remote machine.

    When you have functionality like this, samba simply is not
    a competitor. Its a real disadvantage having to support it
    and all its problematic implementation details.

    There are totally hideos problems in windope file and printer
    sharing. It may all seem to work, but when you have
    specific things like firewalls to have to cross, it
    becomes a total nightmare. I don't understand the
    problems - it seems very basic - something along the lines
    of needing but not having master in the network + caches
    that keep alive ghost shares and names that have long
    since been removed from the network which all makes the
    task of managing the windope protocol all the more
    difficult, dangerous and dodgy.

    Samba is a duplication of windopery and necessarily
    comes with all the mistakes made in windope file
    and printer sharing. I think if you want to share files,
    its far better to use ssh and fish, and drop samba.
     
    7, Oct 1, 2004
    #7
  8. Kevin Pederson

    Dave Uhring Guest

    On that you are quite wrong. The samba server acts just like an NT-4 file
    server. One of my clients is a computer store and dialup ISP. He and his
    bookkeeper have all of their active CRM and accounting files stored on
    that samba server. No business critical data is saved on Windoze
    machines.

    If you want to see the configuration of one of my samba servers then use
    Google's groups advanced search for "smb.conf", comp.unix.solaris, 25 Sept
    2004 and my name.
     
    Dave Uhring, Oct 1, 2004
    #8
  9. Kevin Pederson

    7 Guest

    How can that be?
    You left the preceeding qualifier paragraph out..

    In samba even in a pure GNU/Linux environment, I see
    ghost machines months after removal from the network
    like in windope environment.
    Some of the mistakes in windope environment
    is being duplicated across to reproduce the
    windopey behavior. No doubt someone will one day
    write a ton of code to fix it and then windopes
    will copy it to do a sco.
     
    7, Oct 1, 2004
    #9
  10. Kevin Pederson

    Dave Uhring Guest

    Linux server, Windows clients.
    You are discussing Windows server, Linux client. Who in his right mind
    would do that?
     
    Dave Uhring, Oct 1, 2004
    #10
  11. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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    Perhaps, it's the same person, or just another troll/astroturfer,
    posting through the same nntp server? Which seems to bring us a
    fair share of those remarkable posts lately.

    X-Trace: news.uni-berlin.de

    --
    Michael Heiming (GPG-Key ID: 0xEDD27B94)
    mail: echo | perl -pe 'y/a-z/n-za-m/'
    -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
    Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)

    iD8DBQFBXZDvAkPEju3Se5QRAkgzAKDEIwFSfpL8sa6tDNIOuCdO+5cjfACdGwzo
    1JjuaHXHfg0OsewS7qvtfuY=
    =Mz+7
    -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
     
    Michael Heiming, Oct 1, 2004
    #11
  12. Kevin Pederson

    Dave Uhring Guest

    Is the University of Berlin one of those unis which have sold their souls
    to Microsfot? That might explain the whining article posted by Starnes,
    but the OP in this thread was using Knode.
     
    Dave Uhring, Oct 1, 2004
    #12
  13. Kevin Pederson

    Ivan Marsh Guest

    He was a troll just like you.

    If you have a genuine problem with an OS you don't go into a support forum
    and tell everyone how shitty you think the product is expeting help...
    unless you're a complete fucking moron.
     
    Ivan Marsh, Oct 1, 2004
    #13
  14. On Thu, 30 Sep 2004 21:48:00 -0400, Kevin Pederson wrote:

    I apologize, I was trolled and didn't realize it.
    My bad :(
    Sorry.
    Kevin
     
    Kevin Pederson, Oct 1, 2004
    #14
  15. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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    Nope, but you can get pretty easy a more or less anonymous
    account.
    Dual boot?

    --
    Michael Heiming (GPG-Key ID: 0xEDD27B94)
    mail: echo | perl -pe 'y/a-z/n-za-m/'
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    Version: GnuPG v1.2.4 (GNU/Linux)

    iD8DBQFBXZ8kAkPEju3Se5QRApJ+AJ9qkKyLBVIjoSfQoBA0AD4mxL3PJACfViYc
    zJKgydE4jM0hn6Naouh7X4I=
    =ER91
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    Michael Heiming, Oct 1, 2004
    #15
  16. Kevin Pederson

    Dave Uhring Guest

    On recollection I guess you are correct. I recall a number of articles
    posted to comp.sys.sun.* and comp.unix.solaris from there, particularly one
    where I advised someone with a female name to just buy a used CDROM to
    install the OS on her Sun machine.
    Possible.
     
    Dave Uhring, Oct 1, 2004
    #16
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