WPA won't work with WDS ?

Hi All,

I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.

After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?

Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?

All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
(firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?

All the best ..

T i m

p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
overlooked?

T i m wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
> list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
> into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
> After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
> add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
> (invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
> Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
> and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?
>
> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
>
> All the best ..
>
> T i m
>
> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
> overlooked?

Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and then
will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering table when
the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the MAC address
manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC address is
entered in the table, re-enable filtering.

Q

[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <(E-Mail Removed)> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
GMT, T i m <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?

FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
spoofed.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>

T i m <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
> list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
> into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>
> After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
> add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
> (invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
> Belkin suggest the two shouldn't really be able to talk to each other
> and more importantly WDS doesn't support WPA?
>
> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?

With a few exceptions, WDS only works between APs of the same brand.

The only APs I know of that can do WDS while using WPA are Apple's
AirPort Extreme and Express base stations. They can do WDS with some
non-Apple APs, such as Buffalo's older models, that use Broadcom chips;
but they can't use anything stronger than WEP when doing WDS with
non-Apple APs.

If you just need to add one PC to your wireless network, put an internal
wireless adapter in it or get an external adapter or "bridge" unit that
can operate in client mode. Forget about WDS.

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:28:47 -0600, "Quaoar" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
>> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
>> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
>> overlooked?
>
>Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and then
>will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering table when
>the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the MAC address
>manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC address is
>entered in the table, re-enable filtering.

Hi Q and thanks for the prompt reply ;-)

How would the above pan out if the 'device' connecting to them was a
wireles AP (connecting in bridge mode)?

I don't think I had filtering turned on (because I know it isn't
*that* secure and actually have a mac table on the existing ME102 AP
(FWIW)) and the Belkin router wouldn't let me ad *any* mac address
(inc all 0's or 1's etc) because (I think I now understand from
Belkin) they aren't 'Belkin' mac addresses???

My next test was to see if I could spoof a Belkin mac address in the
Asus (but then I couldn't make the link again so reverted the Asus
back to a simple AP).?

I'll have a look again later though .. ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:28:49 GMT, John Navas
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]
>
>In <(E-Mail Removed)> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
>GMT, T i m <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>>
>>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>
>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>spoofed.

Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
straight client roles John?

All the best ..

T i m

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:48:33 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Neill
Massello) wrote:

>> All I want is a 'remote' PC to be able to hook into my network
>> wirelessly using some strong security ... what do I need to get to do
>> so (or should I be able to morph this Asus into something else
>> (firmware upgrade)) and if so what / where please?
>
>With a few exceptions, WDS only works between APs of the same brand.

Ok, and sorta what the Belkin guy suggested .. however I'm pretty sure
I *had* connection to the net with this setup ..?

Laptop, Ethernet, WL-300g, <802.11g WiFi> i, Belkin, DSL, Inet ..?

The only reason I called then was to find out why I got an "Invalid
mac" message box as soon as I tried to 'apply' the Asus WiFi mac add
in the Belkin's 'AP's that can connect' box? It was then they
suggested that they were surprised it was working at all (being a non
Belkin box at the other end).
>
>The only APs I know of that can do WDS while using WPA are Apple's
>AirPort Extreme and Express base stations.

Ok ..

They can do WDS with some
>non-Apple APs, such as Buffalo's older models, that use Broadcom chips;

(this Asus had 'Broadcom' as the SSID after I applied the firmware
update ??)

>but they can't use anything stronger than WEP when doing WDS with
>non-Apple APs.

Hmm, no (potentially) outside of Apple's arena, WDS doesn't support
WPA ?
>
>If you just need to add one PC to your wireless network, put an internal
>wireless adapter in it or get an external adapter or "bridge" unit that
>can operate in client mode. Forget about WDS.

Welll, that was what I was sorta hoping to do with the Asus WL-300g
but still connect into the Belkin (removing the two Netgear ME102
AP's). It was 'Clueless' (of this very list) that suggested the Asus
on the basis that it would take alternative firmware and therefore
(probably?) do what I wanted?

If I can make this Asus unit work in client mode (and that was a
previous question that received no replies? please see "Asus WL-300g
in 'client mode')" then that would be fine ;-)

Failing that ... would a pair working in AP (local) and WDS / Hybrid
(remote) be more likely to support WPA whilst 'bridging' would you
know / think please Neill?

All the best and thanks for your time ..

T i m

T i m wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 09:28:47 -0600, "Quaoar" <(E-Mail Removed)>
> wrote:
>
>>> p.s. It was suggested that the platform the WL-300g was using was
>>> common to various makers and had an 'active following'. Maybe they
>>> don't use this N/G then as my other requests seem to have been
>>> overlooked?
>>
>> Belkin routers need first a valid IP address for the computer, and
>> then will add the MAC address automatically to the MAC filtering
>> table when the filtering is set to disable. You can also add the
>> MAC address manually if the automatic process failes. Once the MAC
>> address is entered in the table, re-enable filtering.
>
> Hi Q and thanks for the prompt reply ;-)
>
> How would the above pan out if the 'device' connecting to them was a
> wireles AP (connecting in bridge mode)?
>
> I don't think I had filtering turned on (because I know it isn't
> *that* secure and actually have a mac table on the existing ME102 AP
> (FWIW)) and the Belkin router wouldn't let me ad *any* mac address
> (inc all 0's or 1's etc) because (I think I now understand from
> Belkin) they aren't 'Belkin' mac addresses???
>
> My next test was to see if I could spoof a Belkin mac address in the
> Asus (but then I couldn't make the link again so reverted the Asus
> back to a simple AP).?
>
> I'll have a look again later though .. ;-)
>
> All the best ..
>
> T i m

Belkin doesn't exclude non-Belkin products. The MAC address on the
device is separated by colons: 00:04:... but in the MAC table there are
no colons, simply a string of lower case hex digits. If the MAC
filtering is not enabled in the router, then there is no issue there.

What do you see in the router DHCP client table? Does the access point
show up there?

Q

[POSTED TO alt.internet.wireless - REPLY ON USENET PLEASE]

In <(E-Mail Removed)> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 16:30:41
GMT, T i m <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 15:28:49 GMT, John Navas
><(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>In <(E-Mail Removed)> on Mon, 17 Oct 2005 13:06:22
>>GMT, T i m <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>
>>>I recently bought an Asus WL-300g (following suggestions from this
>>>list) with the intention of providing a 'remote' wireless connection
>>>into my Belkin F5D7230-4 WiFi cable router.
>>>
>>>After upgrading the firmware I can connect both using WDS but couldn't
>>>add the Asus's mac in the 'only allow this mac' in the Belkin table
>>>(invalid mac address .. maybe not a 'Belkin' mac addres)?
>>
>>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>>spoofed.
>
>Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
>"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
>straight client roles John?

No better in that filtering role than in any other filtering role.

--
Best regards, HELP FOR CINGULAR GSM & SONY ERICSSON PHONES:
John Navas <http://navasgrp.home.att.net/#Cingular>

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:52:12 GMT, John Navas
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:


>>>FYI, MAC address filtering provides no real security -- it's too easily
>>>spoofed.
>>
>>Indeed, but I didn't know if it acted differently when set in the
>>"allow only AP's with these mac addresses to connect" rather than
>>straight client roles John?
>
>No better in that filtering role than in any other filtering role.

Ok, so don't bother with it then ;-)

All the best ..

T i m