What would generate RF to take out whole road BB?

Hi
BB been down for nearly 2 weeks, finally got a BT engineer round who says
everything is OK from where the Road's cables go into ground but everyone
who is linked overhead from the poles cannot sync at all. Some guy down the
road came out and talked to engineer while they were investigating and said
his BB gone off (and turns out to be at exactly same time as all other
reported faults in road). He said he went out with his AM radio and picked
up loads of noise coming from house at the last pole before it goes
underground.

So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out everyone's
BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to have to get a
'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that going to take to
identify and 'shut up' the culprit?

Will 'special' filters help? (BT engineer said he didn't have any in his van
at the moment, but his mate said should forget about that option and get the
special unit to fix the network problem.)

thanks

Paul

On 3-Apr-2006, "Paul C" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out everyone's
> BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to have to get a
> 'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that going to take to
> identify and 'shut up' the culprit?

Could be something like a video sender, or in fact anything
that uses the same frequency band. Don't expect a quick fix.
BT are not responsible for dealing with electromagnetic
interference, that's a different government dept.
For that you need direction finders for the frequencies
involved which is specialist, and expensive, equipment.
So expect a lot of talk, and little action, until everybody gets
their act together and decides who's responsible for what.
Wired CAT5 Ethernet should be OK.
Filters are unlikely to help, if it's Fire or Police radio breaking
through you can attenuate the specific frequencies, so they don't
overload receivers front ends, causing cross modulation and
breakthrough, but for these higher frequencies forget it
You need to identify the source.

<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> On 3-Apr-2006, "Paul C" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out
>> everyone's
>> BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to have to get a
>> 'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that going to take to
>> identify and 'shut up' the culprit?
>
> Could be something like a video sender, or in fact anything
> that uses the same frequency band. Don't expect a quick fix.
> BT are not responsible for dealing with electromagnetic
> interference, that's a different government dept.
> For that you need direction finders for the frequencies
> involved which is specialist, and expensive, equipment.
> So expect a lot of talk, and little action, until everybody gets
> their act together and decides who's responsible for what.
> Wired CAT5 Ethernet should be OK.
> Filters are unlikely to help, if it's Fire or Police radio breaking
> through you can attenuate the specific frequencies, so they don't
> overload receivers front ends, causing cross modulation and
> breakthrough, but for these higher frequencies forget it
> You need to identify the source.

Ofcom normally investigate radio interference, here is their site:
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/
--
Keith Willcocks
(If you can't laugh at life, it ain't worth living!)

OK, Thanks.
As the modem DSL lights never come on I assume the source is active 24 Hrs
(and the street is entirely residential and there are no industrial units
within half mile).

Paul
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> On 3-Apr-2006, "Paul C" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out
>> everyone's
>> BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to have to get a
>> 'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that going to take to
>> identify and 'shut up' the culprit?
>
> Could be something like a video sender, or in fact anything
> that uses the same frequency band. Don't expect a quick fix.
> BT are not responsible for dealing with electromagnetic
> interference, that's a different government dept.
> For that you need direction finders for the frequencies
> involved which is specialist, and expensive, equipment.
> So expect a lot of talk, and little action, until everybody gets
> their act together and decides who's responsible for what.
> Wired CAT5 Ethernet should be OK.
> Filters are unlikely to help, if it's Fire or Police radio breaking
> through you can attenuate the specific frequencies, so they don't
> overload receivers front ends, causing cross modulation and
> breakthrough, but for these higher frequencies forget it
> You need to identify the source.

Paul C wrote:

> BB been down for nearly 2 weeks, finally got a BT engineer round who says
> everything is OK from where the Road's cables go into ground but everyone
> who is linked overhead from the poles cannot sync at all. Some guy down the
> road came out and talked to engineer while they were investigating and said
> his BB gone off (and turns out to be at exactly same time as all other
> reported faults in road). He said he went out with his AM radio and picked
> up loads of noise coming from house at the last pole before it goes
> underground.
>
> So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out everyone's
> BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to have to get a
> 'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that going to take to
> identify and 'shut up' the culprit?
>
> Will 'special' filters help? (BT engineer said he didn't have any in his van
> at the moment, but his mate said should forget about that option and get the
> special unit to fix the network problem.)

Here's a thought: have you tried knocking on the guys door and saying
"sorry to be a pain in the ass but have you got some whacking great RF
transmitter hooked up?"

I know these days just asking nicely doesn't seem to be The Done Thing,
but IME it seems to be the cheapest and most effective method.

Geoff

On Mon, 3 Apr 2006 11:35:10 +0100, "Keith Willcocks"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Ofcom normally investigate radio interference, here is their site:
>http://www.ofcom.org.uk/

True - but AFAIK only interference to radio (and TV) receivers - not to
telephones, record players or any other things that are not radio receivers.

Geo

Geoff Winkless wrote:
> Paul C wrote:
>
>> BB been down for nearly 2 weeks, finally got a BT engineer round who
>> says everything is OK from where the Road's cables go into ground but
>> everyone who is linked overhead from the poles cannot sync at all.
>> Some guy down the road came out and talked to engineer while they were
>> investigating and said his BB gone off (and turns out to be at exactly
>> same time as all other reported faults in road). He said he went out
>> with his AM radio and picked up loads of noise coming from house at
>> the last pole before it goes underground.
>>
>> So, what could be generating enough RF interference to take out
>> everyone's BB? and what can BT do about it. They say they are going to
>> have to get a 'Specialist Unit' out to deal with it. How long is that
>> going to take to identify and 'shut up' the culprit?
>>
>> Will 'special' filters help? (BT engineer said he didn't have any in
>> his van at the moment, but his mate said should forget about that
>> option and get the special unit to fix the network problem.)
>
>
> Here's a thought: have you tried knocking on the guys door and saying
> "sorry to be a pain in the ass but have you got some whacking great RF
> transmitter hooked up?"
>
> I know these days just asking nicely doesn't seem to be The Done Thing,
> but IME it seems to be the cheapest and most effective method.
>
> Geoff

Not so long ago I came accross a simular thing. A small street where
around 20 of the users were unable to sync up. One customer in
particular made a total pain in the arse of himself by jumping up and
down and righting letters about BT to the local newspaper. The SFI's
were sent and all they could find was a Plasma TV and Baby Alarm (mains
powered) in the street which they duly filtered. Just after this people
were able to kind of sync up again. Then it happened again and I got
caught in the crossfire of getting a job in the street to fix one of the
guys who had been sensible and reported it via his ISP. I found the
fault to be a combination of his extension wiring and the speedtouch 330
modem that he had. It was putting an intermittent partial short accross
the line. Replaced that with some old Westel thing I had in the van and
it's been solid ever since. The funny thing is, his neighbours could not
believe that his had been fixed. It materilised that only he and one
other had been bothered to report the fault. The rest were just moaning
about no broadband and gotten themselves into believing that the fault
was external and causing the problem and mob culture took over.

The moral of my tale, make sure each and everyone has reported the fault
PROPERLY through their ISPs. Make sure the modems cannot sync at the
master sockets without ANY extras connected. Get BT to test each line
for obvious faults. It's not uncommon to have a nice big wet joint or
shot cable causing trouble to a street. The line tester will &usually&
pick these up. It's not uncommon for every microfilter in a house to
fail, it's not uncommon for every modem in a street to fail (if there
has been a crack of thunder somewhere nearby). It's not uncommon to have
been migrated to a faster speed without your knowledge only to find it
won't sync up anymore. Consider all of these before assuming that some
local kid has become a radio pirate. Most electrical and electronic
equipment has been filtered against radio interference for donkeys
years. It's very unusual for it to really come down to this at the end
of the day.

To fire a line test, btw, go to www.bt.com/faults and report your line
as 'overhearing on all calls'. Fill in all the fields and move throught
the form/process. At a given point the line will be tested. If it finds
a significant fault on the line it will come back with 'We have located
a fault in the network' blah blah blah and issue a job number. If it
does not it will warn you that the fault is with your equipment and you
may be charged for a visit. If this is the case drop the fault report as
the line would have tested ok.

Above all, good luck, but don't get drawn into mob culture, it's so rare
you don't even want to think about it. However as long as EVERYBODY
reports the fault via their ISPs the SFI (Special Fault Investigator)
should come out with RF detection gear and may be able to find the
offending item.

"Geo" <hy1k-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Mon, 3 Apr 2006 11:35:10 +0100, "Keith Willcocks"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>Ofcom normally investigate radio interference, here is their site:
>>http://www.ofcom.org.uk/
>
> True - but AFAIK only interference to radio (and TV) receivers - not to
> telephones, record players or any other things that are not radio
> receivers.
>

Agreed, but there is a "Contact OFCOM" selection that gives phone number
etc. The OP could then ask about the correct way forward, although I would
agree with other posters that knocking on the door of the offending house is
the first option.
--
Keith Willcocks
(If you can't laugh at life, it ain't worth living!)