Wireless router signal extension?

Ok, I have a belkin F5D7230-4 router. I'm trying to somehow get a
signal to a house a little less than a mile away. Is this even
possible? The signal strength doesn't have to be very strong. It'll
only be for surfing the web mostly. I'd like to find a solution that
is relatively cheap. If anyone knows a good place that has the
equipment kinda cheap, I would appreciate a link if possible.

Thanks,
Zee

(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> Ok, I have a belkin F5D7230-4 router. I'm trying to somehow get a
> signal to a house a little less than a mile away. Is this even
> possible? The signal strength doesn't have to be very strong. It'll
> only be for surfing the web mostly. I'd like to find a solution that
> is relatively cheap. If anyone knows a good place that has the
> equipment kinda cheap, I would appreciate a link if possible.
>
> Thanks,
> Zee
>

With a stock 802.11G router, it's unlikely. Especially for cheap.

It took me two homebuilt cantennas mounted on tripods with custom
cabling, a Linksys WRT54GS with DD-WRT firmware setup to increase the
power output to 100mW from the default 24mW, and an Orinoco Silver card,
with somewhat decent precision and completely open air, no obstructions,
to get a very low quality connection. Not even very good for Web
browsing. My total direct line of sight according to Google Earth ruler
was about 1.24 miles.

Mind you, the price it would cost to reproduce the project to do this
would be around $125 if you're lucky. This was purely for testing
purposes, I didn't run this setup for more than 20 minutes (yesterday in
fact). If I bought higher quality equipment, higher gain antennas,
better card (my router model is fine). The gear could cost around $300.

If you have a chance, read the message by klim called "satellite router
advice needed" on this newsgroup. I go into more detail there. What I
lay out in there would defiantly help you out if you want to become
serious about this ever.

So what your saying is that it is possible, but not very practical (in
this situation anyway)? Darn, oh well.

It's kinda disappointing though. They can send FM radio for miles and
miles. But it's not easy or cheap at all to get a wireless internet
signal one mile. And yes, I understand that they have 100 foot tall
antennas and much much more powerful and expensive equipment, and FM
waves are probably (For lack of a better term "easier to
transport". But still, come on. I guess it's just not here yet for
the average consumer.

Anyway, thanks for your time,
Zee

(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> So what your saying is that it is possible, but not very practical (in
> this situation anyway)? Darn, oh well.

Yep

> It's kinda disappointing though. They can send FM radio for miles and
> miles. But it's not easy or cheap at all to get a wireless internet
> signal one mile. And yes, I understand that they have 100 foot tall
> antennas and much much more powerful and expensive equipment, and FM
> waves are probably (For lack of a better term "easier to
> transport". But still, come on. I guess it's just not here yet for
> the average consumer.
>
> Anyway, thanks for your time,
> Zee
>

Yes. The term I think you're looking for with "easier to transport" is
signal propagation. Antennas are designed differently for the power
output, and have much less dBi gain. The difference in power outputs, is
very large. On one hand, FM band radio operators have licenses that
allow for power outputs usually around 100 watts. On the other, you as
an unlicensed civilian are limited by the FCC for US residence for
example (here's a summary):

FCC 15.247

3.1.1 - Point to Multi-point
For 802.11b point to multi-point uses, you are allowed up to 30 dBm or 1
watt of Transmitter Power Output (TPO) with a 6 dBi antenna or 36 dBm or
4 watts Effective Radiated Power over an isotropic antenna (EIRP). The
TPO needs to be reduced 1 dB for every dB of antenna gain over 6 dBi.

3.1.2 – Point to Point
For 802.11b point-to-point uses, the FCC encourages directional antennas
to minimize interference to other users. The FCC in fact is more lenient
with point-to-point links, as it only requires the TPO to be reduced by
1/3 of a dB as compared to a full dB for point to multipoint.

More specifically, for every 3 dB of antenna gain over a 6 dBi antenna,
you need to reduce the TPO 1 dB below 1 watt. For example, a 24 dBi
antenna is 18 dB over a 6 dBi antenna. You would have to lower a 1 watt
(30 dBm) transmitter 18/3 or 6 dB to 24 dBm or ¼ watt.

This is similar for 802.11a. Anyhow... There's your dry reading from me.
Hope this made sense.

Bottom line, though the technology is there, the limitations by the FCC
(or laws in whatever country you happen to be in). These limitations are
in place specifically to allow for the amount of signals being operated
by the said consumers. If you get yourself a decent card with a nice
antenna, go outside in a heavily populated area, you'll see a lot of
access points. The number increases every day. Just yesterday, out in
Burbank, California near the NBC and Warner Music Group buildings, you
can with a 14 dBi gain antenna and an 802.11b Apple Airport card (the
older one), you can easily find 150 access points (in passive mode). If
you had a high powered access point, you can over power other access
points and render them useless.

Now I'm just ranting... Hope that helped clear things up.

There are ways to do this.

First thing is: Do you have clear line of sight?
Next: Do some link calculations to see what power you need to do this
at wifi frequencies. Plugging in the numbers is easy, but
understanding what you plug in may require a bit of homework.

Go here to start learning and find link calculators;
http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi
or perhaps this is a bit simpler: http://www.zytrax.com/tech/wireless/intro.htm

Probably you will need two decent AP or client type devices ($100-200
ea.) poles to mount them on up high, enclosures with panel antennas or
grid antennas and coaxial antenna cables.

Probably over $300 to do this, even cheaply.

Steve

seaweedsteve wrote:
> There are ways to do this.
>
> First thing is: Do you have clear line of sight?
> Next: Do some link calculations to see what power you need to do this
> at wifi frequencies. Plugging in the numbers is easy, but
> understanding what you plug in may require a bit of homework.
>
> Go here to start learning and find link calculators;
> http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi
> or perhaps this is a bit simpler: http://www.zytrax.com/tech/wireless/intro.htm
>
> Probably you will need two decent AP or client type devices ($100-200
> ea.) poles to mount them on up high, enclosures with panel antennas or
> grid antennas and coaxial antenna cables.
>
> Probably over $300 to do this, even cheaply.
>
> Steve
>
>

Not trying to start shit... but why are you basically reposting what I
said, a few days after I answered? It makes no sense. At least you
didn't exactly do some copy pasta, and got what information I had
already posted up, correct. I take it as a complement I guess.