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Very simple WiFi question

 
 
Timothy Murphy
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      02-03-2006, 01:57 PM
What exactly is the difference between an Access Point
and an ordinary, eg PCMCIA, WiFi card?
I mean, what is the difference in the way they function?
Does the Access Point send out different packets
when responding to a client?

Is there anywhere online (or at O'Reilly)
where this is explained?

--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail (<80k only): tim /at/ birdsnest.maths.tcd.ie
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
 
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Davide Bianchi
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      02-03-2006, 02:03 PM
On 2006-02-03, Timothy Murphy <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> What exactly is the difference between an Access Point
> and an ordinary, eg PCMCIA, WiFi card?


An A.P. is just a device that connects a wireless device (or more) with
a wired network. It act like a transparent bridge (mostly), he can have some
features like mac-id access control and the like, but mostly is
invisible.

A network card is a network card, and allow a device (computer) to
be connected with a network, wired or wireless.

You can turn a Wi-Fi card and a computer into an AP, but you cannot do
the other way around.

Davide

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Nicholas DePetrillo
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      02-03-2006, 02:06 PM
On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 14:57:36 +0000, Timothy Murphy wrote:

> What exactly is the difference between an Access Point
> and an ordinary, eg PCMCIA, WiFi card?
> I mean, what is the difference in the way they function?
> Does the Access Point send out different packets
> when responding to a client?


Actually there is no difference technically. In fact, I believe the first
generation (V1.0) Linksys WRT54G's came had an internal PCMCIA slot and an
ordinary 100MW Linksys Wifi card plugged into it to act as the radio. In
Linux you can use certain PCMCIA wireless cards in "Master" mode which
effectively turns you into an access point. Sure some commercial access
points might feature certain features in hardware or firmware, an access
point can just be an individual laptop with a regular old Prism2
wireless card plugged in.

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Nick DePetrillo
Network Security Engineer
OSHEAN
PGP Key: http://pgp.mit.edu:11371/pks/lookup?...rch=0x121245B5

 
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Timothy Murphy
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      02-03-2006, 03:34 PM
Nicholas DePetrillo wrote:

>> What exactly is the difference between an Access Point
>> and an ordinary, eg PCMCIA, WiFi card?
>> I mean, what is the difference in the way they function?
>> Does the Access Point send out different packets
>> when responding to a client?

>
> Actually there is no difference technically. In fact, I believe the first
> generation (V1.0) Linksys WRT54G's came had an internal PCMCIA slot and an
> ordinary 100MW Linksys Wifi card plugged into it to act as the radio. In
> Linux you can use certain PCMCIA wireless cards in "Master" mode which
> effectively turns you into an access point. Sure some commercial access
> points might feature certain features in hardware or firmware, an access
> point can just be an individual laptop with a regular old Prism2
> wireless card plugged in.


Thanks for your response.

I should perhaps have said that my query arose
from my experience with my daughter's Sony PSP.
which can access neighbour's APs,
but cannot access my WiFi LAN,
run on WiFi cards in Ad-Hoc mode.
This seems to suggest that the transmission from the APs
is different to that from the WiFi card in my desktop.

All my cards are Orinoco Classic Gold PCMCIA
(or contain this card in USB or PCI devices).
As far as I could see this cannot run in Master mode
(which I assume is the system used by hostap),
but I could be wrong about this?




--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail (<80k only): tim /at/ birdsnest.maths.tcd.ie
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
 
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prg
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      02-03-2006, 04:37 PM

Timothy Murphy wrote:
> What exactly is the difference between an Access Point
> and an ordinary, eg PCMCIA, WiFi card?


Hardware wise there is little difference. Form factor, packaging and
antennas are the main differences. Early APs actually used cards for
their wireless transmitter that were no/little different from the cards
used in laptops.

> I mean, what is the difference in the way they function?


As transceivers, there is no essential difference. An AP has
additional duties and greater workload than a laptop card and must
provide its own processor and memory. APs are not "end user" devices
but are better thought of as network devices akin to switches.

WiFi cards in your laptop or USB port or plug-in cards of a desktop are
the wireless equivalent of ethernet NICs. They provide access to the
wireless medium rather than the wired medium of ethernet.

> Does the Access Point send out different packets
> when responding to a client?


The wireless medium gives new meaning to the words "broadcast medium"
as originally applied to ethernet. It is a _very_ complex (set of)
protocol(s) that is broadly similar to ethernet but that, due to the
medium, requires more intensive access control and traffic management.

Because of the "network" role of the AP, it does indeed send different
packet _types_ than client stations (and vise versa). APs are
responsible for providing their clients _access_ to the airwarves, to
other clients, and (optionally) to an attached ethernet wired network.
Think computerized "air traffic controller". Both APs and clients must
understand the whole protocol in order to "fit into" a wireless
network. Clients using an AP are said to use infrastruture or managed
mode.

But laptops with wireless cards have tranceivers so they should be able
to talk to each other directly, right? Right. These are said to be
using ad-hoc mode, ie., a "temporary" collection of computers
communicating directly with each other. They must share the burdens of
keeping things working right, including many of the services provided
by an AP.

> Is there anywhere online (or at O'Reilly)
> where this is explained?


I've not found a one-stop article, report, or tutorial that covers the
basics of WiFi satisfactorially. The more you look into it, the more
questions arise, and the need for clarifications and distinctions grows
exponentially. About all you can do is use google and pick and choose
on your own in order to answer _your_ questions.

You might start with this -- or a similar -- google search:
wireless home network tutorial
http://www.google.com/search?num=50&...twork+tutorial

Wireless home networking can get pretty complicated today but is more
likely to provide less technical explanations to get you started with
the basics. After that, you should have enough terms under your belt
to google till you drop.

cheers,
prg

 
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