USB vs PCI Card

Is there much difference between these 2 wireless antenna in order to use
one over the other? Cost is not important, but reliability is the primary
concern.

Thanks

--
Email no good, reply to group

On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 15:10:11 GMT, "JE" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Is there much difference between these 2 wireless antenna in order to use
>one over the other? Cost is not important, but reliability is the primary
>concern.

Incidentally, they are both "radios", "bridges", or "client adapters"
and not an "antenna".

USB had a very small antenna and no provision for an external antenna.
PCI has an antenna connector which an external coax cable and remote
antenna can be installed. The stock 1/4 wave antenna tends to get
buried behind the PC, in the middle of a mess of wires, under a desk,
up against the wall, etc. In other words, a really lousy antenna
location.

If you're looking for "reliability" start looking for an external
antenna and a good location if you select PCI. You will lose some
signal in the coax cable so you're limited to about 3ft using the tiny
RG-174 coax found on most aftermarket antennas.

USB can be extended to 16ft maximum cable (without amplifiers) which
allows more positioning options. However the radio sections of most
USB cards is (in my never humble opinion) generally inferior to those
found on MiniPCI cards (which is the basis of almost all PCI card
client adapters). In addition, USB radios tend to use tiny PIFA
antennas which have terrible antenna gain.

USB is somewhat cheaper than PCI, especially if you add an external
antenna to the PCI card.

Bottom line is that USB has the advantage of lower cost, simpler
installation, and easier positioning of the radio/antenna. PCI is
somewhat better but only if you add an external antenna.




--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks!


"Jeff Liebermann" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 15:10:11 GMT, "JE" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>Is there much difference between these 2 wireless antenna in order to use
>>one over the other? Cost is not important, but reliability is the primary
>>concern.
>
> Incidentally, they are both "radios", "bridges", or "client adapters"
> and not an "antenna".

On the Linksys USB module has a thing that looks like and
"antenna"....catches a signal anyway!
>
> USB had a very small antenna and no provision for an external antenna.
> PCI has an antenna connector which an external coax cable and remote
> antenna can be installed. The stock 1/4 wave antenna tends to get
> buried behind the PC, in the middle of a mess of wires, under a desk,
> up against the wall, etc. In other words, a really lousy antenna
> location.
>
> If you're looking for "reliability" start looking for an external
> antenna and a good location if you select PCI. You will lose some
> signal in the coax cable so you're limited to about 3ft using the tiny
> RG-174 coax found on most aftermarket antennas.

I notice that many of the cards I have seen have only about a 2ft cable, so
you can't get much positioning.
>
> USB can be extended to 16ft maximum cable (without amplifiers) which
> allows more positioning options. However the radio sections of most
> USB cards is (in my never humble opinion) generally inferior to those
> found on MiniPCI cards (which is the basis of almost all PCI card
> client adapters). In addition, USB radios tend to use tiny PIFA
> antennas which have terrible antenna gain.
>
> USB is somewhat cheaper than PCI, especially if you add an external
> antenna to the PCI card.
>
> Bottom line is that USB has the advantage of lower cost, simpler
> installation, and easier positioning of the radio/antenna. PCI is
> somewhat better but only if you add an external antenna.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
> 150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
> Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> USB had a very small antenna and no provision for an external antenna.
> PCI has an antenna connector which an external coax cable and remote
> antenna can be installed. The stock 1/4 wave antenna tends to get
> buried behind the PC, in the middle of a mess of wires, under a desk,
> up against the wall, etc. In other words, a really lousy antenna
> location.

I don't know if I would agree with "very small" for the USB, unless you
were talking about a USB mini-dongle. Even that would be superior to a PCI
card with the antenna buried behind a PC. The mini-dongle could be stuck
to the wall with a bit of tape.

http://www.linksys.com/products/grou...rid=33&scid=36
WUSB54G USB "standard" adapter $54.99
has about the same size antenna as
WMP54G PCI $49.99
to which you could add any number of antennas, including the
"Hawking HAI6SDA Directional 6dBi 2.4GHz Antenna" $39.99
http://www.hawkingtech.com/prodSpec.php?ProdID=143

Or you could get the
http://www.hawkingtech.com/prodSpec.php?ProdID=208
"Hawking Technology HWU54D Hi-Gain Wireless-B USB Adapter" $56.99 which
would be a USB client radio built into the 6dBi antenna.

I have a DLink DWL-122 mini-dongle which I have been quite happy with, but
it's not available anymore. Some of the mini-dongles are closeouts at
$10-20 after rebates, so that's the cheapest way to go. I carry mine with
me to set up a quick ad-hoc connection to people's computers that don't
have any networking installed.
http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=1&pid=334 is the 54g version.

---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> If you're looking for "reliability" start looking for an external
> antenna and a good location if you select PCI. You will lose some
> signal in the coax cable so you're limited to about 3ft using the tiny
> RG-174 coax found on most aftermarket antennas.

The "Hawking HAI6SDA Directional 6dBi 2.4GHz Antenna"
http://www.hawkingtech.com/prodSpec.php?ProdID=143
Uses RG 316 Cable, maybe a meter in length, terminated at RP-SMA.
That would be 1.2dB loss.

The Linksys WMP54G shows that it has a 5dBi antenna, so that's a net loss.

The system where I installed the Hawking antenna had a Netgear WG311,
which has the tiny antenna. The antenna made an improvement.

---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5

On Fri, 1 Jul 2005 16:53:55 +0000 (UTC), (E-Mail Removed)
wrote:

>I don't know if I would agree with "very small" for the USB, unless you
>were talking about a USB mini-dongle. Even that would be superior to a PCI
>card with the antenna buried behind a PC.

Agreed. I wasn't thinking of the USB radios with the 1/4 wave
"tilt-up" antennas. They're considerably better on antenna gain than
the mini-dongle or whatever devices with the PIFA circuit board
antenna. However, I've noticed that the radio portion of these larger
USB radios are the same as the mini-dongles. Only the package and the
antennas are different.

>The mini-dongle could be stuck
>to the wall with a bit of tape.

Retch. Depends on what's in the wall. If there are metal studs in
the wall, or a masonry wall full of water, methinks it wouldn't work
too well. However, it's easy enough to shove a Styrofoam or cardboard
spacer between the dongle and the wall to get some separation.

>I have a DLink DWL-122 mini-dongle which I have been quite happy with, but
(...)

One of my neighbors uses a WUSB54 on her desktop and a DWL-120 on her
laptop to connect to the neighborhood wireless LAN. She has to shoot
about 150ft, though a mess of trees, to see the antenna. The WUSB54
is kinda flaky but works well enough. They have to reposition the
antenna when the trees move around.

The DWL-120 is a lost cause. It looks through the same window but
only sometimes makes a connection. I bought 5 of these at $15 and
have had range and sensitivity problems with all of them. I
sacrificed one and installed an SMA connector in place of the PIFA
antenna. With an external antenna, it worked better but not great.
I'm not sure if I got the matching correct, so the lousy performance
may have been the result of my handiwork instead of something inherent
in the design.


--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 16:47:01 GMT, "JE" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On the Linksys USB module has a thing that looks like and
>"antenna"....catches a signal anyway!

I was thinking of the mini-dongle style and for some reason forgot
about those. Sorry. The WUSB54G is a tolerable USB radio with a much
better antenna than the mini-dongle. Because it can be more easily
positioned than the external antenna, it might be a better solution.
The antenna is incidentally a 1/4 wave radiator and roughly the same
as the stock antenna found on most PCI cards.

>I notice that many of the cards I have seen have only about a 2ft cable, so
>you can't get much positioning.

I think 3ft is typical. Any more would be too lossy.

Methinks the best compromise would be the Hawkings USB radio, that
Clarence Dold mentioned, with the directional panel antenna. You get
the long USB cable, easy positioning of the radio, and some
directional antenna gain. Directional gain is very useful for
reducing unwanted reflections from inside walls and furniture.


--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 10:59:58 -0700, Jeff Liebermann
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I was thinking of the mini-dongle style and for some reason forgot
>about those. Sorry. The WUSB54G is a tolerable USB radio with a much
>better antenna than the mini-dongle.

The WUSB11 or WUSB54G can also be tweaked for an external antenna:
http://www.carnetix.com/WUSB11/Page.html

Per the authors instructions, don't drop it. I would also solder the
connector to the ground plane on the bottom of the board, which is why
dropping it on the connector probably destroyed the connections.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 AE6KS 831-336-2558

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> One of my neighbors uses a WUSB54 on her desktop and a DWL-120 on her
> laptop to connect to the neighborhood wireless LAN. She has to shoot
> about 150ft, though a mess of trees, to see the antenna. The WUSB54
> is kinda flaky but works well enough. They have to reposition the
> antenna when the trees move around.

> The DWL-120 is a lost cause. It looks through the same window but
> only sometimes makes a connection. I bought 5 of these at $15 and
> have had range and sensitivity problems with all of them. I

I bought three. One, I thought was comparable to an Orinoco, but the one
I'm left with now is not as good as the Netgear WG511.
I don't know if it was batch variance between the DLinks, or just the time
of day when I was doing comparisons.

---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley (Lake County) CA USA 38.8,-122.5

On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 15:10:11 GMT, "JE" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Is there much difference between these 2 wireless antenna in order to use
>one over the other? Cost is not important, but reliability is the primary
>concern.

Neither of those is an antenna.

>Thanks
>
>--
>Email no good, reply to group
>

Barry
=====
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