Two wireless routers one network

Im having wireless connection and network file sharing issues with the
below setup......
My set up
- Cable modem into Linksys WRT54G
- Four wired connections going out of WRT54G to four different Internet
enabled clients.
- One of 4 clients(Studio PC) is now not a client it's connectted 2 a
Linksys BEFW11S4
- Changed BEFW11S4's default gateway to 192.168.0.1 with DHCP enabled
- The studio PC is Internet enabled on a different default gateway

So accomplished one thing, which was ability to add more network
devices in studio. But, I am unable to access all the files on
192.168.1.1 network from the Studio PC(192.168.0.1). What to do?

Also, these two wireless routers are 300 feet apart of each other. I
want the ability to have XP laptop automatically connect to the closest
Wi-Fi point. Oddly enough, the only way that I can connect wirelessly
now is thru the Linksys BEFW11S4, but only when I hard code into laptop
an IP, the BEFW11S4's default gateway and my ISP's DNS??? Strange

How can I access the files on the other default gateway and can I
properly configure my wireless network as I seek?

Cheers, Chaser!

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

>Im having wireless connection and network file sharing issues with the
>below setup......
>My set up
>- Cable modem into Linksys WRT54G
>- Four wired connections going out of WRT54G to four different Internet
>enabled clients.
>- One of 4 clients(Studio PC) is now not a client it's connectted 2 a
>Linksys BEFW11S4
>- Changed BEFW11S4's default gateway to 192.168.0.1 with DHCP enabled
>- The studio PC is Internet enabled on a different default gateway
>
>So accomplished one thing, which was ability to add more network
>devices in studio. But, I am unable to access all the files on
>192.168.1.1 network from the Studio PC(192.168.0.1). What to do?

That's because you have what is called "double NAT". You can see
machines and shares in one direction, but not backwards (WAN->LAN) in
the other direction. What you need to do is convert your BEFW11S4
from a wireless router to a wireless access point. That will put the
BEFW11s4 and all its connected client computers on the same IP block
as the WRT54G.

On the BEFW11s4:
1. Setup the LAN IP address to 192.168.1.2 so it is on the same IP
block as the WRT54G.
2. Disable the DHCP server.
3. The WAN (internet) port is not used.
4. Connect a CAT5 cable between a LAN port on the WRT54G and a LAN
port on the BEFW11s4. Make sure the lights come on at both ends when
you plug in this cable.
5. You can use any SSID or channel number on the BEFW11s4. It does
not need to be the same as the WRT54G. This is helpful if you want to
manually select whether a client connects to the WRT54G or the
BEFW11s4.

You should now have an access point instead of a wireless router. ALL
your wireless clients should use the DHCP server in the WRT54G to get
their IP addresses, so everything should be on the same IP block, and
hopefully, every machine should see each other.

>Also, these two wireless routers are 300 feet apart of each other. I
>want the ability to have XP laptop automatically connect to the closest
>Wi-Fi point.

Nope. Can't be done at this time. 802.11r (fast roaming) is suppose
to take care of this eventually. Use different SSID's on the two
wireless devices and you can manually select to which one you connect.

>Oddly enough, the only way that I can connect wirelessly
>now is thru the Linksys BEFW11S4, but only when I hard code into laptop
>an IP, the BEFW11S4's default gateway and my ISP's DNS??? Strange
>
>How can I access the files on the other default gateway and can I
>properly configure my wireless network as I seek?
>
>Cheers, Chaser!
--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks Jeff....

Im wondering is Cat5 cable the same thing as a crossover cable? If so,
then I need to rearrange the wiring connection scheme on the connection
going into the BEFW11S4.

Cheers, Chaser

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

>Im wondering is Cat5 cable the same thing as a crossover cable? If so,
>then I need to rearrange the wiring connection scheme on the connection
>going into the BEFW11S4.

Sorta. The WRT54G to BERW11S4 connection should be a CAT5 cable wired
to EIA-568B standards. However, it does NOT need to be wired for a
crossover derrangement as the WRT54G does auto polarity sensing (or
something like that). I just checked my setup and the cable between
the two LAN ports is an ordinary ethernet EIA-568B cable. If the
lights appear correctly on the front panels when you plug the cable
in, it will work.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks Jeff....I sucessfully added the ability to add additional wired
connections in my studio and they are connectted to the BEFW11s4 and
getting their IP from the WRT54G.

Unfortunately, my wireless device(laptop) will not acquire an IP
address from either router. My laptop detects both routers and states
a strong signal, but something is preventing it from picking up an IP
from either.

You say, "You can use any SSID or channel number on the BEFW11s4. It
does
not need to be the same as the WRT54G. This is helpful if you want to
manually select whether a client connects to the WRT54G or the
BEFW11s4."

Can I just name them the same thing? I tried it with different SSID's
and channels, with no luck and tried naming both routers the same SSID
name and channel .

Thanks again for your help

Chaser

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

>Thanks Jeff....I sucessfully added the ability to add additional wired
>connections in my studio and they are connectted to the BEFW11s4 and
>getting their IP from the WRT54G.

One down...

>Unfortunately, my wireless device(laptop) will not acquire an IP
>address from either router. My laptop detects both routers and states
>a strong signal, but something is preventing it from picking up an IP
>from either.

Nothing is preventing it from getting an IP address. The usual
problem is incompatible WEP keys. There are two ways that the overly
user friendly manufacturers of wireless contrivances convert WEP keys
from ASCII to Hex. If you're using WEP, use the Hex key on the client
and it will probably work.

>You say, "You can use any SSID or channel number on the BEFW11s4. It
>does
>not need to be the same as the WRT54G. This is helpful if you want to
>manually select whether a client connects to the WRT54G or the
>BEFW11s4."
>
>Can I just name them the same thing? I tried it with different SSID's
>and channels, with no luck and tried naming both routers the same SSID
>name and channel .

"No luck" is not in my list of common failure modes. A rabbits foot
or other charm might improve your luck, but I doubt if the router will
cooperate. Try it temporarily with no encryption. If that works, fix
the WEP key.

I prefer to explain how it works and let you decide if that's the way
you want your network to operate. If you use the same SSID for both,
you in effect have a "roaming" situation, where each client radio
automagically decides which access point is "best". You have no
choice. The driver decides for you.

Unfortunately, most client drivers are fairly stupid about when to
switch between access points. They will tenaciously hang onto a weak
signal and not switch to the stronger router until the signal is
totally lost. The client often guesses wrong as to which is the
initial "best" access point. Using the same SSID will work, but
roaming around the house is problematic. Intel has at least
recognized the problem and offers adjustable "persistence" in their
Proset 9 drivers.

By using different SSID's, your client has the choice of which access
point to connect. You can't roam around the house and must manually
disconnect and reconnect when switching access points.

If you use the same SSID, be sure to use the same WEP key or you'll
drive some clients insane.

You should use different RF channels to avoid mutual interference,
especially if the two access points can hear (or see) each other. The
client will autoscan all the channels looking for a matching SSID and
will use any channel that it finds (as set by the access point).

For testing, I suggest you start with different SSID's, different
channels, and no encryption. When that works with both access points,
then turn on the encryption.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Thanks for all your help! I accomplished almost exactly what I wanted
to. I can choose between which router I want to connect to. Albeit,
my laptop states Not Connectted(under view wireless connection) with
it's interaction with the WRT54G, but I have an IP and I am surfing the
web. Also, at times after five or ten minutes Window Zero config will
connect to the BEFW11s4 signal even when it's much farther then the
WRT54G.

I tried to disable Windows Zero and just use the Broadcom default, but
the Broadcom thing in the taskbar never appears and I can't connect.
Any idea how to truly disable Windows Zero and get the Broadcom up and
working? I went to WLAN --> properties --> Wireless network tab --->
remove check from let Windows configure network settings - OK.
Unfortunately, the Broadcom red icon never appears and I can't connect.

Chaser7016

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

>Thanks for all your help! I accomplished almost exactly what I wanted
>to. I can choose between which router I want to connect to. Albeit,
>my laptop states Not Connectted(under view wireless connection) with
>it's interaction with the WRT54G, but I have an IP and I am surfing the
>web.

Some wireless drivers and cards (i.e. Broadcom and some Belkin) do not
properly report a successful connection to Windoze. Everything will
work just fine, but the icon in the system tray says "not connected".
Usually, a driver update will solve the problem.

>Also, at times after five or ten minutes Window Zero config will
>connect to the BEFW11s4 signal even when it's much farther then the
>WRT54G.

Yep. Windoze always wants to connect to the fastest connection, not
the strongest or the bestest connection.

>I tried to disable Windows Zero and just use the Broadcom default, but
>the Broadcom thing in the taskbar never appears and I can't connect.
>Any idea how to truly disable Windows Zero and get the Broadcom up and
>working? I went to WLAN --> properties --> Wireless network tab --->
>remove check from let Windows configure network settings - OK.
>Unfortunately, the Broadcom red icon never appears and I can't connect.

Well the usual method is to disable the Wireless Zero Config service:
http://www.ifelix.co.uk/tech/2000.html
The Broadcom client should appear in the system tray. If not, find it
from the laptop manufacturers or other site and reinstall. Be sure to
create a restore point with "system restore" first, so you can recover
from any screwups.


--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 10:02:36 -0800, in alt.internet.wireless , Jeff
Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Yep. Windoze always wants to connect to the fastest connection, not
>the strongest or the bestest connection.

This is incorrect, at least under XP. If you remove them from the
preferred connections list, or deprioritise them, it will do what it
should.
My next door neighbour's routers often have stronger signals in my
garden than my own router, but I never have connection surprises.

Mark McIntyre
--
"Debugging is twice as hard as writing the code in the first place.
Therefore, if you write the code as cleverly as possible, you are,
by definition, not smart enough to debug it."
--Brian Kernighan

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On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 22:07:40 +0000, Mark McIntyre
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On Mon, 23 Jan 2006 10:02:36 -0800, in alt.internet.wireless , Jeff
>Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>Yep. Windoze always wants to connect to the fastest connection, not
>>the strongest or the bestest connection.

>This is incorrect, at least under XP. If you remove them from the
>preferred connections list, or deprioritise them, it will do what it
>should.
>My next door neighbour's routers often have stronger signals in my
>garden than my own router, but I never have connection surprises.

I beg to differ. I had the displeasure of dealing with a local
"evolutionary" hotel wireless network. The hotel maintenance person
had a decent electronics background and built up the system from
essentially junk. There were about 8ea access points going to a
central router. No two access points were the same model. Some were
802.11b only, some were 802.11b/g, and some were set to 802.11g only.
The entire network was on one SSID. (The 802.11g only was for video
feeds in the conference room area).

It all worked acceptably well except for an odd roaming problem.
Sniffing the traffic found that almost all of the traffic was going
through the 802.11b/g access points, while the 802.11b access points
were only moving traffic from one, that happened to be in an isolated
corner of the hotel. Basically, the 802.11b only access points were
not being utilized.

I was sitting in front of an 802.11b only access point, and the laptop
insisted on connecting to a distant 802.11b/g access point. The
signal level for the 802.11b only access point was 5 bars, while the
802.11b/g was about 1 bar. I tried every trick I could think of to
make XP SP2 connect to the access point in front of my face but it
insisted on connecting to the distant 802.11b/g access point.

Now it gets weird. I disabled Wireless Zero Config and fired up Intel
Proset 9.x on a 2200BG MiniPCI card. It too insisted on connecting to
the fastest but distant access point. However, Proset has the ability
to control the persistence of the connection. It would switch back an
forth between the distant and local access points, as depending on
interference, propogration, signal strength, and possibly phase of the
moon. I could sit there and watch it switch back and forth roughly
once per minute.

As a temporary fix, I changed the SSID of the 802.11b only access
points to something different. XP SP2 would instantly connect to the
correct local access point and would ignore the weaker 802.11b/g
access points. Even the evil "use any available connection" worked
amazingly well. A few days later, I arrived with a box of 802.11g
routers, which replaced the 802.11b only access points. Everything
went back to the same SSID. This time, XP SP2 would select the
strongest signal from the nearest access point.

I'll admit that this was not exactly a prefect test to determine what
criteria Windoze uses to select an access point if all the SSID's are
the same. However, it appears that Windoze will take the fastest
connection first, no matter what the signal strength, noise level, or
error rate.


--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558 (E-Mail Removed)
# http://802.11junk.com (E-Mail Removed)
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS