Tiscali Fair Use Policy - Many unanswered questions.

Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy (FUP) has
had a change of times for the weekend period. These times used to be 12pm
to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now changed to 6pm to 11pm
at weekends, which follows the rest of the weekday times scheduled for FUP.

A few qustions now, which Tiscali have thus far failed to state the answers
to in their FUP guidelines;

They state; 'Try to keep your use to web browsing and email during these
periods'.

The question is, what do Tiscali determine exactly as web browsing?

Does this mean that Tiscali customers cannot listen to streaming radio
services, and are banned from downloading *anything* at all during the hours
of the FUP? Can we watch video on the BBC website for example, of does this
constitute breaking the rules of the FUP? What exactly is allowed and what
is not?, I for one dont know the answer to this simple question!

Tiscali also state; 'Don't download large files during the hours of the
FUP'

What exactly is that supposed to mean? What does Tiscali call a large file
exactly? 1MB, 10MB, 100MB, or what? We have no guidelines that tell us
this, and that makes the FUP rules very difficult to adhere to.

Are Tiscali actually saying that you are in danger of being affected by the
FUP, if you use the internet at all during these times?

Furthermore, are there any other hidden limits outside the hours of the FUP?
If not does that mean that outside the FUP, the customer is quite free to
download and upload as heavily as they like, without being worried about
getting an FUP warning email? For instance, if the customer was to schedule
all heavy use outside the hours of the FUP, and make *VERY VERY HEAVY* use
of the service at these times, would they still be pulled up by Tiscali for
abusing the system outside the hours of the FUP, or would that be considered
OK because it was outside the FUP hours?

Tiscali have already sent me a FUP Warning1 a few weeks ago, even though I
had kept my use down very low between the FUP hours, so does this mean that
they are just targetting their customers randomly, just to make their lives
difficult when using the internet? I specifically made a point of
installing bandwidth reduction software here to ensure that I wasn't
affecting the service at peak times, but still got the first FUP warning1.
I certainly dont know why they have chosen to send me a warning, when I was
one of the people who was trying to help keep to the rules in the first
place. It seems that when you keep your bandwidth down, they are still not
happy with you using the service at peak times.

If someone who works for Tiscali would care to comment in this thread, I
would very much like to hear what we CAN and CANNOT do in the hours of the
FUP, as their website guidelines are as clear as mud. Web browsing is a
general term, which means nothing specific and could include listening to
online radio stations, watching video clips, downloading large email
attachments, watching internet TV stations etc etc. Some of these web
browsing activities will make use of large amounts of bandwidth. so how can
Tiscali state just web browisng and email are OK? Are they saying that I
can receive loads of large email attachments and that doesn't matter? If
the answer to this is YES, then they are trying to control what software you
use at specific times of the day. The FUP also states that they ban the use
of P2P use during peak hours. Can anyone tell me the difference between the
use of bandwidth controlled P2P, and any other use of your bandwidth, for
downloading email attachment etc? Surely if you are controlling the
bandwidth of your useage to a low level, then its nothing to do with Tiscali
what software you are using?

Am I missing something, or was someone right the other day when they said
Tsicali was the ISP of choice for people who are scared of a computer? I am
getting to feel that Tiscali are becoming bad for my wellbeing, and that I
should be moving sooner rather than later if I intend to stay in reasonable
health.

All these silly threats and rules just wouldn't be necessary if they made
the service capable of handling the amount of customers they have, and if
need be, increase the monthly cost of the service to make it more viable and
reliable. I never wanted them to reduce the price and make the service
poorer with constant restrictions, they chose to do that one themselves. We
are paying a company just to get constant reminders about when and where we
can use the service. Its not good enough!

I have a friend who has been with Freeserve (now Wanadoo) for a few years
now. He signed up on an unlimited package two years ago and he never
suffers from his ISP warning him about his useage all the time, and I can
tell you he uses the net for downloading a lot more than I do (Infact he
constantly uses P2P all day and night), you can't be a much higher user than
that!

Isn't it time we had some definitive guidelines as to what is allowed and
what is not allowed when the FUP is in force, so that everyone knows exactly
where they stand with this load of nonesense?

John

John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy (FUP) has
> had a change of times for the weekend period. These times used to be 12pm
> to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now changed to 6pm to 11pm

Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
arguments about exactly when 12pm is!

--
Chris Green

Thus spaketh (E-Mail Removed):
> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
>> (FUP) has had a change of times for the weekend period. These times
>> used to be 12pm to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now
>> changed to 6pm to 11pm
>
> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!

12pm is Midday so how would you argue against that?

In news:kxApf.11626$(E-Mail Removed). uk,
{{{{{Welcome}}}}} <bhx___spam@trapped___hotmail.co.uk> opined very noisily:
> Thus spaketh (E-Mail Removed):
>> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
>>> (FUP) has had a change of times for the weekend period. These times
>>> used to be 12pm to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now
>>> changed to 6pm to 11pm
>>
>> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
>> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!
>
> 12pm is Midday so how would you argue against that?

12 hours PM ( Post Meridian )is 24.00 or 00.00 Midnight
12 hors AM (Ante Meridian) is also 24.00 or 00.00
Simpler to use the 24 hour clock and lose 2 minutes from the day
The day ends at 23.59 hrs and starts at 00.01 hrs
--

Yddap
Remove guts to reply

<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> > Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
(FUP) has
> > had a change of times for the weekend period. These times used to
be 12pm
> > to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now changed to 6pm
to 11pm
>
> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!
>
> --
> Chris Green
>
There is no such thing as 12 pm, it's either 12 noon or 12 midnight.
Perhaps Tiscali need to be taught all about the use of the 24 hour
clock, that is if they are clever enough, which I somehow doubt.
Regards Mike.

Mike wrote on Mon, 19 Dec 2005 16:19:49 -0000:

> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
> (FUP) has
>>> had a change of times for the weekend period. These times used to
> be 12pm
>>> to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now changed to 6pm
> to 11pm
>>
>> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
>> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!
>>
>> --
>> Chris Green
>>
> There is no such thing as 12 pm, it's either 12 noon or 12 midnight.
> Perhaps Tiscali need to be taught all about the use of the 24 hour
> clock, that is if they are clever enough, which I somehow doubt.
> Regards Mike.

So you were never taught what 12pm is at school then? Even my 6 year old
daughter knows what 12pm is! I might not be technically accurate to use 12
pm, but it's been accepted use since for a very long time. I guess you must
have real trouble handling TV guides - do you keep missing programs that are
labelled as being on at 12pm?

Dan

Thus spaketh Yddap:
> In news:kxApf.11626$(E-Mail Removed). uk,
> {{{{{Welcome}}}}} <bhx___spam@trapped___hotmail.co.uk> opined very
> noisily:
>> Thus spaketh (E-Mail Removed):
>>> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
>>>> (FUP) has had a change of times for the weekend period. These
>>>> times used to be 12pm to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they
>>>> have now changed to 6pm to 11pm
>>>
>>> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
>>> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!
>>
>> 12pm is Midday so how would you argue against that?
>
> 12 hours PM ( Post Meridian )is 24.00 or 00.00 Midnight
> 12 hors AM (Ante Meridian) is also 24.00 or 00.00
> Simpler to use the 24 hour clock and lose 2 minutes from the day
> The day ends at 23.59 hrs and starts at 00.01 hrs


Yes, I virtually always use the 24hr clock with 0:00 being midnight, hate the
use of 24:00 for midnight.

However we were taught at school that 12pm was midday and 12am was midnight.

But I always use 12 Noon to mean midday and 12 Midnight for midnight and not
12pm / 12am as there are some people who get confused.

Spack wrote to Mike GW8IJT on Mon, 19 Dec 2005 17:18:48 -0000:

> Mike wrote on Mon, 19 Dec 2005 16:19:49 -0000:
>
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>>> John <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy
>> (FUP) has
>>>> had a change of times for the weekend period. These times used to
>> be 12pm
>>>> to 4pm on weekends and Bank Holidays, they have now changed to 6pm
>> to 11pm
>>>
>>> Well if it's stated as "12pm to 4pm" you could have some interesting
>>> arguments about exactly when 12pm is!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Chris Green
>>>
>> There is no such thing as 12 pm, it's either 12 noon or 12 midnight.
>> Perhaps Tiscali need to be taught all about the use of the 24 hour
>> clock, that is if they are clever enough, which I somehow doubt.
>> Regards Mike.
>
> So you were never taught what 12pm is at school then? Even my 6 year old
> daughter knows what 12pm is! I might not be technically accurate to use 12
> pm, but it's been accepted use since for a very long time. I guess you
> must have real trouble handling TV guides - do you keep missing programs
> that are labelled as being on at 12pm?

Hell, I've been at work at work so long today I've forgotten how to type
correctly.

* It might not be technically ...

* but it's been accepted use for a very long time

Dan

On 19 Dec 2005 16:00, "Yddap" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>12 hours PM ( Post Meridian )is 24.00 or 00.00 Midnight
>12 hors AM (Ante Meridian) is also 24.00 or 00.00

however in common use, 12:00 am = 00:00 and 12:00 pm = 12:00


--

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John wrote:
> Firstly Tiscali have announced today that their Fair Use Policy (FUP) has
> had a change of times for the weekend period.

At least they let you know.

If you don't like them, vote with your feet and get a different 'better'
ISP. Preferably one whose FUP you agree with and will stop whinging about.

--
The Caretaker .........