I'm a CCNA but can't figure out why my Wireless Internet connection is so slow...

Fellow networkers,

I have a Cable modem at home with download speeds of 13 - 15Mb/s. I
love it! Unfortunately, I only measure those speeds on my wired
computers. The wireless ones (I tried 2 laptops using 2 different
PCMCIA cards) only get around 6.5-7 Mb/s when downloading from the
Internet.

NOTE: when transferring a file from my wired computer to the wireless
one, I did get around 15Mb/s. That's slow but it proves that the
wireless computer can receive more than 7Mb/s.

I am using my new Linksys WRT54GS. Both laptops are P4, 512MB RAM,
Win XP SP2. Here is what I tried to eliminate the obvious:

1. Tried both laptops with the same card. Same results, hence not a
computer problem.
2. Tried both laptops with a wired connection. Got 13Mb/s. Again,
not a computer issue. Router is capable.
3. I tried a different wireless card on both laptops. Back to 7Mb/s.
I guess that rules out the wireless adapter.
4. I changed from WPA to WEP and then to no encryption at all. No
improvement.
5. I tried different wireless channels. No luck.
6. I unplugged my only 2.4GHZ cordless phone. Nope. Router is fine.
7. I moved to the room where the router resides. No improvement. I
guess there is no major signal loss.
8. Brought a new laptop from work with an internal Mini-PCI card. Same
speed. Not a PCMCIA limit.
9. Switched back to the old router (Netgear MR814v2). Same old, same
old.

The only thing I am yet to try is using a USB wireless adapter but I
doubt it will show any better speeds.

Is Wireless Internet severely limited? Am I missing something?

Thanks in advance for any advice,
Dotan



dotan_ak@yahoo.com

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

Ever consider the possibilty that you can't figure it out because you
have a CCNA? Just a thought.

>I have a Cable modem at home with download speeds of 13 - 15Mb/s. I
>love it!

Cease bragging. I've only got 1.5Mbits/sec.

>Unfortunately, I only measure those speeds on my wired
>computers. The wireless ones (I tried 2 laptops using 2 different
>PCMCIA cards) only get around 6.5-7 Mb/s when downloading from the
>Internet.

It should be much faster than that. I just ran a quicky wireless
benchmark test using IPerf just yielded 18Mbits/sec TCP thruput on my
home WRT54GSv4. It's a bit slow because the neighbors are doing
something on my connection via wireless. See:
<http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi#Performance_and_Speed>
for maximum theoretical speeds.

>NOTE: when transferring a file from my wired computer to the wireless
>one, I did get around 15Mb/s. That's slow but it proves that the
>wireless computer can receive more than 7Mb/s.

It would be best if you take the internet out of your benchmarks. If
you have a wired desktop (not wireless) available, setup IPerf server
on it and do your wireless benchmarking locally. That will also take
the router and cable modem out of the picture.
<http://dast.nlanr.net/Projects/Iperf/>

>I am using my new Linksys WRT54GS.

What hardware version (look on serial number tag)?
What firmware version (see status page)?

>Both laptops are P4, 512MB RAM,
>Win XP SP2.

Cool. You have 2 machines. Do the IPerf server thing with one of
them in wired configuration.

On the wireless laptop, at what wireless speed are you connecting to
the WRT54GS? Your thruput should be about half the connection speed.

>Here is what I tried to eliminate the obvious:

From Sherlock Holmes: When we have eliminated the obvious, the
apparent, and those items unworthy of being checked, what remains,
however improbable, is what we have overlooked and have screwed up.

Do you have simultaneous wired and wireless connections running on the
test laptop? The "route print" command will show the current router
table. Look at the "metric" column to see which route has preference.
Most XP laptops will autoswitch between wireless and wired but I've
seen a few utilities that screw things up.

I'll admit that you did a good job of trying to isolate the problem.
The trouble is that you're apparently doing everything with an
internet benchmarking tool. That's fine for later, but makes it
difficult to clearly identify the culprit. Try it without the
internet first.

>Is Wireless Internet severely limited? Am I missing something?

No, not that severely.

1. Connect BOTH laptops to the WRT54GS via CAT5 cables. Unplug the
cable modem to keep it out of the way. Run IPerf benchmark in TCP
mode (with default parameters). At 100baseT-FDX, you should get about
80Mbits/sec or more. Basically, we're testing the IPerf software and
computers with this test.

On the server:
IPerf -s
On the client:
IPerf -r -c ip_address_of_server
The -r will do a non-simultaneous bi-directional test in case the
problem is asymmetrical.

If the numbers here are unusually low, check:
netstat -s | more
for any IP and TCP layer errors. Any errors are probably at the MAC
layer, but you'll need to fish those out with the ethernet card
diagnostics.

2. Now, replace one of the CAT5 cable with a wireless connection and
run the same IPerf benchmarks again. Note the wireless connection
speed. You should get about half the connection speed.

Let us know what you get here and we'll blunder onward depending on
the wireless benchmark results.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Please check the current firmware version of the WRT54GS (take note of
the hardware version to ensure that you selected the firmware version
correctly if there is a need to upgrade it). Go to linksys.com/download
and compare if you have the latest. You can take a look on the Firmware
Release Notes.

If you have the latest firmware, check if you need to update the
drivers for your card....


(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> Fellow networkers,
>
> I have a Cable modem at home with download speeds of 13 - 15Mb/s. I
> love it! Unfortunately, I only measure those speeds on my wired
> computers. The wireless ones (I tried 2 laptops using 2 different
> PCMCIA cards) only get around 6.5-7 Mb/s when downloading from the
> Internet.
>
> NOTE: when transferring a file from my wired computer to the wireless
> one, I did get around 15Mb/s. That's slow but it proves that the
> wireless computer can receive more than 7Mb/s.
>
> I am using my new Linksys WRT54GS. Both laptops are P4, 512MB RAM,
> Win XP SP2. Here is what I tried to eliminate the obvious:
>
> 1. Tried both laptops with the same card. Same results, hence not a
> computer problem.
> 2. Tried both laptops with a wired connection. Got 13Mb/s. Again,
> not a computer issue. Router is capable.
> 3. I tried a different wireless card on both laptops. Back to 7Mb/s.
> I guess that rules out the wireless adapter.
> 4. I changed from WPA to WEP and then to no encryption at all. No
> improvement.
> 5. I tried different wireless channels. No luck.
> 6. I unplugged my only 2.4GHZ cordless phone. Nope. Router is fine.
> 7. I moved to the room where the router resides. No improvement. I
> guess there is no major signal loss.
> 8. Brought a new laptop from work with an internal Mini-PCI card. Same
> speed. Not a PCMCIA limit.
> 9. Switched back to the old router (Netgear MR814v2). Same old, same
> old.
>
> The only thing I am yet to try is using a USB wireless adapter but I
> doubt it will show any better speeds.
>
> Is Wireless Internet severely limited? Am I missing something?
>
> Thanks in advance for any advice,
> Dotan

Thank you Jeff and Annie.

I will run IPerf tonight andwill then report the results. I wasn't
aware of it. You're right about the CCNA. If it's not Cisco, they
won't mention it... It's still a good-to-have certification.

For Internet speed tests I used speakeasy.net/speedtest. My WRT54GS is
hardware Ver 6 and I installed the latest firmware from Linksys which
is now 1.51.0.

I usualy get 48-54Mb/s as my connection speed. I thought that my old
Netgear router (.11b) was at fault and according to you 5.5-6Mb/s is
about as much as I could get from it anyway. It was time to get a new
one...

I'll be back later with the results.

Thanks again,
Dotan

(E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:

>For Internet speed tests I used speakeasy.net/speedtest. My WRT54GS is
>hardware Ver 6 and I installed the latest firmware from Linksys which
>is now 1.51.0.

The WRT54GS v5 and v6 have problems. See:
<http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/26843/51/>
In general, the v6 is the same as the v5.
<http://www.linksysinfo.org/forums/showthread.php?t=47124>
I've tried to convince several WRT54G v5 units, that my customers
dragged home, into working, but gave up and exchanged them for other
units.

>I usualy get 48-54Mb/s as my connection speed. I thought that my old
>Netgear router (.11b) was at fault and according to you 5.5-6Mb/s is
>about as much as I could get from it anyway.

With an 11Mbit/sec 802.11b connection, the best you can theoretically
do is about 6Mbits/sec. See chart at:
<http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi#Performance_and_Speed>

>It was time to get a new one...

Just a note. Many of the wireless features will actually slow you
down if they are not used. 802.11b compatibility will limit you to
about 15Mbits/sec if there is an 802.11b client connected. Similarly,
if you have the Afterburner or Speedboost enabled, but not in use, it
will reduce the peak speeds to non-SpeedBoost enabled clients. Try
disabling all the fancy features and limit your testing to stock
802.11g only.

>I'll be back later with the results.
>Thanks again,
>Dotan

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> I will run IPerf tonight andwill then report the results. I wasn't
> aware of it. You're right about the CCNA. If it's not Cisco, they
> won't mention it... It's still a good-to-have certification.

iperf runs two parts, a server and a client.
On one machine
iperf -s
On the other machine
iperf -c ip_address_of_machine_one
will run a default 10 second transmission from machine one to two.
This can be across OS types, and I run from an internet Unix system through
my NAT router to my PC.

--
---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

> (E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:
>
> Ever consider the possibilty that you can't figure it out because you
> have a CCNA? Just a thought.
>

DOH !!!

On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 23:51:35 +0100 (CET), DanS
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>news:(E-Mail Removed) :
>
>> (E-Mail Removed) hath wroth:
>>
>> Ever consider the possibilty that you can't figure it out because you
>> have a CCNA? Just a thought.

>DOH !!!

Well, there does seem to be some confusion here between cause and
effect. Troubleshooting expertise is not obtained by studying for and
passing exams. It's obtained by getting one's hands dirty and
developing an understanding of how things really work. My theory is
that once one understands how something works, the troubleshooting is
merely the systematic elimination of probable causes[1]. The
inability to get one's hands dirty and get real experience is also why
phone tech support is often useless for troubleshooting.

I have nothing against certifications and certificates. I have a
personal attachment to certificates as I partially supported myself
during college days running a diploma mill. Certificates also saves
some testing effort during the job application and hiring ordeal. It
also guarantees that the applicant knows all the buzzwords from about
3-5 years ago, so we presumably can talk the same language. For
myself, I'm self-certified and too busy to take the exams. If I need
a certificate, I just fire up the certificate factory software, and
produce one on demand. Something like my old warranty card:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/drivel/slides/diploma.html>
There's another on the wall that proclaims that I'm a "Computer
Expert" which entitles me to be arrogant, obnoxious, egotistical,
pontifical, and short tempered to clients and customers. In the 16
odd years that it's been on the wall, only a few people have noticed
and nobody has complained. Yeah, I like certificates.



[1] Once upon a time, I had a lucrative business driving to the
server farms in the middle of the night to perform server and network
troubleshooting. The highlight of one of these trips was watching two
or three CCNE/MCSE holders, busily trying to restore connectivity to a
rack full of servers, when all the lights were off on the switch.
Repair consisted of plugging the switch back in and then wasting an
hour undoing the damage the certificate holders had done trying to
reconfigure the system (because they didn't cover themselves by
keeping a log or making backups). Certificates don't necessary do
much for troubleshooting.

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558 (E-Mail Removed)
# http://802.11junk.com (E-Mail Removed)
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

On Sun, 21 Jan 2007 19:00:17 -0800, dotan_ak wrote:

> Fellow networkers,
>
> I have a Cable modem at home with download speeds of 13 - 15Mb/s. I
> love it! Unfortunately, I only measure those speeds on my wired
> computers. The wireless ones (I tried 2 laptops using 2 different
> PCMCIA cards) only get around 6.5-7 Mb/s when downloading from the
> Internet.
>
> NOTE: when transferring a file from my wired computer to the wireless
> one, I did get around 15Mb/s. That's slow but it proves that the
> wireless computer can receive more than 7Mb/s.
>
> I am using my new Linksys WRT54GS. Both laptops are P4, 512MB RAM,
> Win XP SP2. Here is what I tried to eliminate the obvious:
>
> 1. Tried both laptops with the same card. Same results, hence not a
> computer problem.
> 2. Tried both laptops with a wired connection. Got 13Mb/s. Again,
> not a computer issue. Router is capable.
> 3. I tried a different wireless card on both laptops. Back to 7Mb/s.
> I guess that rules out the wireless adapter.
> 4. I changed from WPA to WEP and then to no encryption at all. No
> improvement.
> 5. I tried different wireless channels. No luck.
> 6. I unplugged my only 2.4GHZ cordless phone. Nope. Router is fine.
> 7. I moved to the room where the router resides. No improvement. I
> guess there is no major signal loss.
> 8. Brought a new laptop from work with an internal Mini-PCI card. Same
> speed. Not a PCMCIA limit.
> 9. Switched back to the old router (Netgear MR814v2). Same old, same
> old.
>
> The only thing I am yet to try is using a USB wireless adapter but I
> doubt it will show any better speeds.
>
> Is Wireless Internet severely limited? Am I missing something?
>
> Thanks in advance for any advice,
> Dotan

I wouldn't let these guys put you down for "tooting your horn". You should
be proud of your accomplishments. That said, they're right in that a piece
of paper doesn't mean that you can troubleshoot anything. Conversely, not
having that certification and/or education doesn't mean that you can't fix
stuff - it's just that most employers require the certification/education.
OTOH, no one can be expected to fix everything on their own - to believe
otherwise is unrealistic. Anyway, I believe your intent was to inform
others that you have substantial knowledge of networking so that they
don't have to "dumb down" their explaination so that you would understand.

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> Well, there does seem to be some confusion here between cause and
> effect. Troubleshooting expertise is not obtained by studying for and
> passing exams. It's obtained by getting one's hands dirty and
> developing an understanding of how things really work.

Fixing the problem is usually easy...finding what the problem is hard.