Simplest wireless configuration for this home network?

I'm trying to set up a quickie wireless network for this
home situation:

Computer #1: Desktop running WinXP
Computer #2: Laptop running Win2000
Internet: Currently dialup, upgrading to cablemodem
eventually. Laptop should share the desktop's internet
connection.
File sharing: Across the wireless network.

I've set up countless wired networks before, but tried to
do a wireless setup this time because it seemed the best
way to keep the laptop "mobile" around the house and to
avoid needlessly running wires across rooms.

But my first stab at it hasn't worked -- maybe I'm
going about it the wrong way in the first place; this
is my first attempt at wireless.

So what hardware would you use to do this quick
cheap, and easy?

I tried putting a Linksys WPC54G Wireless-G Notebook
Adapter (PCMCIA) card in the laptop, and a Linksys
WRT54G Wireless-G Broadband Router on the desktop
(thinking I needed it as a "base unit" connection point
for the home network), but it doesn't seem to be working.
I can get the laptop's card to "find" the router and hook
up, and the desktop recognizes its router and can talk to it,
and the laptop can talk to its card, but no file sharing
occurs and no Internet Connection Sharing occurs, even though
I've properly configured filesharing/ICS in ways that has
always worked for me on wired networks.

I'm suspecting that the Broadband Router is designed to share
*only* a broadband internet connection that's plugged directly
into the router (which I can't do with the current dial-up
obviously), so that probably explains why the internet isn't
sharing, but I'm not sure why the file sharing isn't working --
shouldn't that occur over the wireless link when I've got the
desktop's ethernet cable plugged into one of the Router's
LAN ports?

....or am I misunderstanding -- does the Broadband Router
*only* network things (both wireless and wired) to the shared
internet port, and do no other kind of "internetworking" LAN-wise?
I expected it to allow file sharing via: laptop -> notebook
adapter -> wireless connection -> broadband router -> desktop.
Is that not the case?

If I'm not using the appropriate hardware for what I want to do
(file sharing *and* internet sharing over wireless, with
internet being dialup and/or cablemodem), then what should I
be using?

And can I get away with all computers being ad-hoc wireless,
or do I need a "connection point" at the desktop? (As I
said, I'm new to wireless -- I thought it would just be like
wired networking with some of the "wires" being a radio connection,
but apparently there are some fundamental differences.)

Thanks in advance.

"Dan Day" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> I'm trying to set up a quickie wireless network for this
> home situation:
>
> Computer #1: Desktop running WinXP
> Computer #2: Laptop running Win2000
> Internet: Currently dialup, upgrading to cablemodem
> eventually. Laptop should share the desktop's internet
> connection.
> File sharing: Across the wireless network.
>
> I've set up countless wired networks before, but tried to
> do a wireless setup this time because it seemed the best
> way to keep the laptop "mobile" around the house and to
> avoid needlessly running wires across rooms.
>
> But my first stab at it hasn't worked -- maybe I'm
> going about it the wrong way in the first place; this
> is my first attempt at wireless.
>
> So what hardware would you use to do this quick
> cheap, and easy?
>
> I tried putting a Linksys WPC54G Wireless-G Notebook
> Adapter (PCMCIA) card in the laptop, and a Linksys
> WRT54G Wireless-G Broadband Router on the desktop
> (thinking I needed it as a "base unit" connection point
> for the home network), but it doesn't seem to be working.
> I can get the laptop's card to "find" the router and hook
> up, and the desktop recognizes its router and can talk to it,
> and the laptop can talk to its card, but no file sharing
> occurs and no Internet Connection Sharing occurs, even though
> I've properly configured filesharing/ICS in ways that has
> always worked for me on wired networks.
>
> I'm suspecting that the Broadband Router is designed to share
> *only* a broadband internet connection that's plugged directly
> into the router (which I can't do with the current dial-up
> obviously), so that probably explains why the internet isn't
> sharing, but I'm not sure why the file sharing isn't working --
> shouldn't that occur over the wireless link when I've got the
> desktop's ethernet cable plugged into one of the Router's
> LAN ports?
>
> ...or am I misunderstanding -- does the Broadband Router
> *only* network things (both wireless and wired) to the shared
> internet port, and do no other kind of "internetworking" LAN-wise?
> I expected it to allow file sharing via: laptop -> notebook
> adapter -> wireless connection -> broadband router -> desktop.
> Is that not the case?
>
> If I'm not using the appropriate hardware for what I want to do
> (file sharing *and* internet sharing over wireless, with
> internet being dialup and/or cablemodem), then what should I
> be using?
>
> And can I get away with all computers being ad-hoc wireless,
> or do I need a "connection point" at the desktop? (As I
> said, I'm new to wireless -- I thought it would just be like
> wired networking with some of the "wires" being a radio connection,
> but apparently there are some fundamental differences.)
>
> Thanks in advance.

Simplest approach. (In fact, I did this prior to getting broadband.)

I'd keep the router in the box until you get broadband.

Use the wireless clients in the desktop and laptop in AdHoc mode, with ICS
enabled. Bridge the "Dialup Adapter" to the wireless client on the desktop.
This will pass internet traffic. For file sharing, just the standard
applies -- either with TCP/IP (Netbios over TCP/IP enabled) or NetBEUI.
(NetBEUI isn't routable, so when the router comes into play later will
either have to use TCP/IP for filesharing or encapsulate NetBEUI into IPX.)

It'll talk. I suspect that using dialup over-the-air for multiple PC's will
have you going to broadband sooner than later though. :^)

Cheers,
-Eric

Taking a moment's reflection, Dan Day mused:
|
| I'm trying to set up a quickie wireless network for this
| home situation:

I assume the desktop is dialing up with a modem, and that you have a NIC
in the desktop as well. With the desktop computer configured for ICS, plug
the NIC into one of the 4 dataports on the router (not the WAN port). This
will set the router to working as a switch rather than a router. Go into
the router's setup options, and disable DHCP. Configure the wireless
settings, and then you should be able to connect wirelessly with your
laptop, and receive an internal IP from the desktop's ICS DHCP ... and thus
share the dial up connection.

When you get broadband, re-enable DHCP on the router, disable ICS on
your desktop, plug the cable/DSL modem into the WAN port, and you should be
back in business there as well.

On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:29:39 GMT, "mhicaoidh"
<®êmõvé_mhic_aoidh@hotÑîXmailŠPäM.com> wrote:

>Taking a moment's reflection, Dan Day mused:
>|
>| I'm trying to set up a quickie wireless network for this
>| home situation:
>
> I assume the desktop is dialing up with a modem, and that you have a NIC
>in the desktop as well.

Yes.


> With the desktop computer configured for ICS, plug
>the NIC into one of the 4 dataports on the router (not the WAN port).

Already done.


>This
>will set the router to working as a switch rather than a router.

That's what I was thinking, but so far no go.


> Go into
>the router's setup options, and disable DHCP. Configure the wireless
>settings, and then you should be able to connect wirelessly with your
>laptop, and receive an internal IP from the desktop's ICS DHCP ... and thus
>share the dial up connection.

Ah, cool, I'll go over there and give this a shot later today.


> When you get broadband, re-enable DHCP on the router, disable ICS on
>your desktop, plug the cable/DSL modem into the WAN port, and you should be
>back in business there as well.

Excellent. Thanks so much for your quick response. I'll let you
know how it goes after I try the DHCP tweak.

> "Dan Day" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>
> I'm suspecting that the Broadband Router is designed to share
> *only* a broadband internet connection that's plugged directly
> into the router (which I can't do with the current dial-up
> obviously), so that probably explains why the internet isn't
> sharing, but I'm not sure why the file sharing isn't working --
> shouldn't that occur over the wireless link when I've got the
> desktop's ethernet cable plugged into one of the Router's
> LAN ports?
>
> ...or am I misunderstanding -- does the Broadband Router
> *only* network things (both wireless and wired) to the shared
> internet port, and do no other kind of "internetworking" LAN-wise?
> I expected it to allow file sharing via: laptop -> notebook
> adapter -> wireless connection -> broadband router -> desktop.
> Is that not the case?
>

You have something set up incorrectly.. I use the same (wrt54g) both wired
and wireless, and also have a VPN setup, and a PDA (built in wifi).. When in
Northern Idaho, it's on cable, but where it's warmer (I'm in Las Vegas for
the winter), I use dial-up and Cell-phone set for ICS.

Just to be clear, if I am connected to broadband I don't need ICS, but when
I use a dial-up or cell on one of the machines on the wap/router, I need
ICS.

If you want to share between the machines, you have to set sharing on the
hard disks. While there are many ways to do it, I find it easier for me to
add the program file explorer (in the windows directory, left off so people
won't confuse it with internet explorer), but it's distributed with windows.

You didn't say what operating sys you use, but that specific router (linksys
wrt54g) has an updated firmware as of dec 6th, that you will need for XP
SP2.
There is a free installer and the update at the linksys website.

Both my laptops have hardwire AND wireless connections. I have them both
installed (NOT bridged), and just enable/disable the ones I need/don't
need..

"Dan Day" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message

> Excellent. Thanks so much for your quick response. I'll let you
> know how it goes after I try the DHCP tweak.

My apologies. My previous reply was based on the (incorrect) assumption
that you currently have the following hardware:

- Gateway Router/AP
- Wireless client hardware in the desktop (Along with dialup modem and
ethernet NIC card, obviously)
- Wireless client hardware in the laptop

From re-reading your post more carefully, it seems that the desktop does not
have any wireless hardware?
(Therefore the Adhoc approach I mentioned would require purchasing an
additional piece of wireless hardware.)

Yeah, using the router (connected to the desktop's ethernet NIC, bridged to
the dialup adapter) as Mhicaoidh suggested will work just fine. Ethernet
cable from the desktop's NIC goes into the one of the LAN ports on the
router, not the WAN, obviously.

I'm doing something "somewhat similiar" to that, in fact, with a wireless
router. I'm using a PC as a "WIFI Gateway" (running a program called
"ZoneCD") to create a subnet that allows tighter control of wireless
clients. The PC running "ZoneCD", like ICS, does all the DHCP for the
subnet. The wireless router connected the the "ZoneCD PC" needed only to
function as a "switch" and give AP functionality, so likewise it is
connected by a LAN port and not the WAN. DHCP on the wireless router, of
course, is disabled. Subsitute the "ZoneCD PC" for a PC (ethernet NIC
bridged to dialup adapter) and seems to be pretty much the same thing you
are wanting to do.

Picture of the topology at:
http://www.publicip.net/zonecd/how.php

Cheers,
-Eric

On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:29:39 GMT, "mhicaoidh"
<®êmõvé_mhic_aoidh@hotÑîXmailŠPäM.com> wrote:

> When you get broadband, re-enable DHCP on the router, disable ICS on
>your desktop, plug the cable/DSL modem into the WAN port, and you should be
>back in business there as well.

Oh, one more thing... (I haven't been over to try out the DHCP
thing yet.)

I can see how the DHCP setting might be the key for getting the
dialup internet sharing properly (until they get cablemodem), but
if this fixes the file sharing as well, won't the file sharing
stop working once they get cablemodem service and I switch the
DHCP setting back? Or is that another issue entirely which
hasn't been addressed yet?

Taking a moment's reflection, Dan Day mused:
|
| I can see how the DHCP setting might be the key for getting the
| dialup internet sharing properly (until they get cablemodem), but
| if this fixes the file sharing as well, won't the file sharing
| stop working once they get cablemodem service and I switch the
| DHCP setting back? Or is that another issue entirely which
| hasn't been addressed yet?

No. Filesharing should not be affected since it is handled via TCP/IP
stack rather than the router. One more thing, you might need to make sure
the IP address that is assigned to the router has a subnet that matches what
your ICS is using ... though, it's been a while since I set up a network
this way, so I could be wrong.

The problem you were likely having was the outer was assigning an IP to
your wireless client that was on a different node/subnet than what ICS would
be giving it.

On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 23:34:58 GMT, "mhicaoidh"
<®êmõvé_mhic_aoidh@hotÑîXmailŠPäM.com> wrote:

>Taking a moment's reflection, Dan Day mused:
>|
>| I can see how the DHCP setting might be the key for getting the
>| dialup internet sharing properly (until they get cablemodem), but
>| if this fixes the file sharing as well, won't the file sharing
>| stop working once they get cablemodem service and I switch the
>| DHCP setting back? Or is that another issue entirely which
>| hasn't been addressed yet?
>
> No. Filesharing should not be affected since it is handled via TCP/IP
>stack rather than the router. One more thing, you might need to make sure
>the IP address that is assigned to the router has a subnet that matches what
>your ICS is using ... though, it's been a while since I set up a network
>this way, so I could be wrong.
>
> The problem you were likely having was the outer was assigning an IP to
>your wireless client that was on a different node/subnet than what ICS would
>be giving it.

Er, why would the ICS be affecting the filesharing? Shouldn't that be
a separate issue?

Taking a moment's reflection, Dan Day mused:
|
| Er, why would the ICS be affecting the filesharing? Shouldn't that be
| a separate issue?

Yes, and I didn't say it was. I did, however, run two ideas together in
the same paragraph. ;-) It should have read:

> No. Filesharing should not be affected since it is handled via TCP/IP
>stack rather than the router.

> One more thing, you might need to make sure
>the IP address that is assigned to the router has a subnet that matches
>what
>your ICS is using ... though, it's been a while since I set up a network
>this way, so I could be wrong. The problem you were likely having was the
>router was assigning an IP to your wireless client that was on a different
>node/subnet than what ICS would be giving it.