Senao 2611 CB3 Deluxe Challenges

New topic heading - Jeff Liebermann had posted on this subject in
another thread:

Thanks, Jeff, for the post. Just a couple of comments inline:

Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> "Skip - Working on the boat" <(E-Mail Removed)> hath wroth:
>
> >So, if one manufacturer's data presentation is totally untrustworthy,
> >with me always in my continuing barbequing (always getting burned by
> >believing vendors), how *does* one determine the veracity of claims
> >made for eqiupment available without doing your own testing (totally
> >impractical for all but a very few)?
>
> I've been following your adventures with the Senao hardware. By using
> the previous criteria, the last person I would believe would be the
> salesman that sold you the hardware. Tech support is also useless
> because they have probably never used or installed the hardware
> they're supporting. There are many reports of other users deploying
> the same Senao hardware without any difficulties (and in some cases,
> with superior results). Google can easily find these. That means
> that you're doing something wrong, but I can't determine what. I
> think you need onsite help by someone with wireless experience.

I'll try googling for a good report. With any luck it will show up in
something like this and I can actually get to talk with someone about
how they succeeded. I'm hopeful of getting a cogent (well,
technically, *any* response would be somewhat surprising) reply to a
very complete RFH from Senao corporate tech support.

>
> I've avoided trying to help you because frankly, I don't think you're
> approaching the problem systematically. Each section of your wireless
> maze needs to be individually tested before it is conglomerated into a
> floating wireless LAN. Despite advice to disassemble the parts and
> piece and test them, you've consistently tried to make it work as a
> total system. That won't work (unless you're very lucky) and
> certainly is useless for pointing the finger at the problem or the
> culprit. Divide and conquer.

I don't have a clue (perhaps you could help?) about how to further
separate. Just as a basis (removed during the ethernet portions of the
test), I have a Hawking USB antenna. I'ts what makes this post
possible. It also (with its configuration utility) tells me the SSID,
Mac and strengths of all the visible SSIDs. At least fair for seeing
what to expect from the Senao gear.

With the internal wifi card disabled, and the Hawking unplugged, I set
about solely to make (one of the) units perform as a bridge. Perhaps
it's a matter my expectations. As already specified elsewhere, I am
clueless about networking minutiae. However, what I expected was to be
able to find an AP and communicate with it, through an antenna attached
to one of these units configured as a bridge, in much the same fashion
as I do with my internal wifi antenna (disabled for all but the most
infrequent appearances outside either my home or boat) or my USB
antenna. So, if that's the problem, you're quite right, I need to
start over. "Over" in the most basic sense, too, as, if I can't do it
as above, I clearly don't have any clue about what hardware is required
to get me communicating with a remote AP...

Onward to separation and defeat (so far, any way):

1) The ethernet portion of my testing setup seems to work just fine,
as demonstrated by my ability to configure the card when connected
(more below). I can reliably configure it to DHCP or specify IP and
subnets, along with extras in the advanced section, in the event I
wanted to use it to directly talk to more than one piece of gear, each
with its own IP and subnet set. I *am* rather irritated by Windoze'
inability to toggle between DHCP and specific settings, requiring
manual entry each time I leave the DHCP. So, link 1 works. As a
subset, it behaves in the same fashion whether I use the supplied 6'
crossover, or the 4" pigtail (the better to use when two are in a small
box) I made up. So, links 1a and 1b work.

2) The power supply appears to work. That is, it powers the unit and I
can reach/configure the unit once it's powered. So, link 2 works.

3) The antenna (the one I expect to use with the bridge) (and the
pigtail connector) appears to work. That's because it sees the same
APs, in the same power range, as the Hawking does. Because I have been
unable to make the unit work, I've not bothered to attempt verifying
the other antenna. If I ever succeed with the bridge configuration,
I'll check out the duck. Link 3a works; 3b, with its different pigtail
(different antenna end) is left untouched for the moment.

4) The unit itself is a very mixed bag. There are 3 lights and a
reset button.

The antenna light rarely comes on, though, over the more than 12
months that I've been valiantly (foolishly is more likely) attempting
to make this system work, it has, in the past, come on. Removing and
reinserting the antenna doesn't change that result. In the times when
it works to that level, it sees the same SSID as my Hawking does, so
the connection point and coax pigtail of the antenna work. 4a is
flaky.

The power light comes on when attached to the wall wart by the
provided plug. It also goes off when the manual reset button is
pushed. 4b seems to work.

Pushing the manual reset returns the card to factory defaults. 4c
seems to work.

The ethernet light comes on when there's a cable inserted (note
that it doesn't mean anything about connectivity - just that there's
something in the hole), and off when removed. I can also configure the
unit when the ethernet cord or pigtail is inserted and the unit
returned to factory default. 4d seems to work.

So, there's the mechanical report on the unit. Both (I have two,
supposedly to make an AP/Bridge pair) behave in the same fashion
mechanically.

5) The performance report you probably saw as a part of the "up the
mast" thread. Without repeating it here, I sequenced through each of
the available options (select one of two possibilities), starting with
factory default, attempting to communicate at each point. Various
failures resulted. Both of these units is supposedly able to perform
as either a bridge or AP. However, I've been testing them only in the
bridge mode. Until I have a working bridge, there's no point in trying
to make it communicate through an AP unit.

Regardless of the result of the many different configuration option
selections, and the various different information returns (see SSID,
don't see SSID, associate SSID, don't associate SSID, release IP, don't
renew, etc.), and regardless of the configuration of the NIC, I have
not succeeded in passing/retrieving data to/from the net. That's in
any case, but in particular when (in the times when it *will*
associate) associated with the SSID I'm using right now, therefore
confirmed open and available. So, 5 is a failure.

Given that I have not been able to make this perform as a bridge, I've
not gone beyond that point for quite a while. If I could ever make the
bridge work (neither unit works as a bridge, both have current firmware
flashes), I could go on to attempting to make the setup (the same as
provided me by my vendor) Mr. Navas has asserted will work perform,
whether the two units were piggybacked or separated by lots of ethernet
cable and a 60+ foot metal column (sorry, I know you sail - I'm just
frustrated).

So, how may I further divide and experiment? At this point I have no
illusions about the conquering part. The stubborn side of me wants to
know WTF is going on.

L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
bought her

The Society for the Preservation of Tithesis commends your ebriated
and scrutible use of delible and defatigable, which are gainly, sipid
and couth. We are gruntled and consolate that you have the ertia and
eptitude to choose such putably pensible tithesis, which we parage.

>>Stamp out Sesquipedalianism<<

On 2 Jul 2006 06:49:00 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed). com>:

>[BIG SNIP]

Again, follow my last few responses to you. Pay particular attention to
IP address issues, written to address your particular problem, and now
part of the wiki.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

Hi, John,

John Navas wrote:
> On 2 Jul 2006 06:49:00 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
> Again, follow my last few responses to you. Pay particular attention to
> IP address issues, written to address your particular problem, and now
> part of the wiki.

I must have missed those responses, as I didn't see any which addressed
IP issues. And, as you may have seen in the firmware download post,
I'm not really sure what I have.

However, here's an update on what I've been doing:

*** laptop (during radio configuration):
IP: 192.168.1.252
gateway: 192.168.1.1

*** CB3 bridge:
point-to-multipoint mode
SSID DUMMY (to be changed later)
IP: 192.168.1.251
gateway: 192.168.100.1

*** CB3 access point:
Set for CH 11
SSID BoatAP
IP: 192.168.1.250
gateway: 192.168.100.1

First, I configured the units, bare (no antennae), one at a time. As
indicated in other posts, I've never had a difficulty reaching the
configuration pages. Curiously, when I did the switch to AP from
bridge (recall that I'd been testing both units attempting to succeed
in surfing with either of them in bridge mode), it vacillated, showing
on the screen that it was changing back and foth several times. A
refresh of the screen (giving it a kick?) finally got it to settle down
in AP mode. I commenced setting up the parameters, naming and
otherwise preparing to make the two interact. Leaving both powered up,
I disconnected the NIC line. So far, so good.

Holding my breath, I connected them. Every other time I'd connected
them, I'd get immediate IP conflict messages. This time, nothing.
Hallelujah. Movement from where we'd been. These were both sitting on
my keyboard (I use an external keyboard with my laptop) and so my
internal wifi saw 'boat AP' loud and clear. So, I set about seeing if
they could communicate.

I started with the bridge (ethernet NIC and crossover cable, with the
stick antenna),set on the cabin roof, with the stick hung from the same
place as the Hawking I've been communicating through, and beat on it
umpteen times. Varying between "dummy" - which would not scan,
"wireless" (the default, which also would not scan), "sailing router" -
the AP I use with the Hawking adapter (sorry about the designation of
antenna earlier).- and (any) - the empty space for the SSID
specification, which *would* scan, I was eventually able to make it
associate with the 'sailing router'

The first several tries, it would not surf. More beating and toggling
(ok, resetting to different parameters) of SSID finally yielded an
association which would surf. Unfortunately, that was in the "any"
(nothing shown in the SSID line) mode, so I tried again. Eventually I
succeeded in getting an association with 'sailing router' which would
surf. During this bit, no other changes than SSID designationi were
done, so I have no idea whey it succeeded and other times didn't. None
the less... A first, in more than a year. If I could make this
stable, that, at least, is a starting point. Given that my computer use
would nearly always be at the nav (well, I'd be more comfortable
somewhere else, but it serves, at least!), being tethered by cat5 is at
least manageable.

So, I went on to reconnect the other unit, leaving the one which I'd
succeeded in the same state, powered up, but not connected to anything.
I attached both antennas to the appropriate pieces. I had them both
powered with an extension cord, and now they were on the cabin roof
under the dodger, with the stick hanging from the same place as the
Hawking, and the duck hanging into the salon below.

So, holding my breath, I connected them again with the crossover
pigtail. No IP conflicts!! That's a first, in a year plus.

Next was to turn on the internal wifi adapter. Holy cow! It
connected.

I wish that were the end of the story. Unfortunately, it's not. While
I was able to surf and mail for a while, and at what seemed to be
excellent speed and connectivity, the IP conflict reared its ugly head
again, and things ground to a halt.

Power cycling, by unplugging the extension cord, worked for about a
minute (after perhaps an hour of uptime before).

Fast forward to today, where I've been attempting to make it stable
again. Still (irregular - no predictability) IP conflicts, whether the
internal adapter is in DHCP or static mode as above. I can only
irregularly interrogate the bridge in static mode, never the AP, with
the internal adapter. As I type, having just repowered after a couple
hours off, there isn't an IP conflict, but my internal adapter can't
reach the bridge, where it did a moment ago It shows connected with
excellent strength to the AP, but can't interrogate it, either. Of
course, when I go to dhcp, I'll not be able to interrogate them at all,
and, having repowered in the "any" (no SSID in the blank), it connected
to the strongest signal, which isn't open. Attempting to reset it to
'sailing router' - the one my Hawking adapter uses successfully - has
made the bridge unreachable again.

So, there you have it. Like "Sleepers" - the movie - there was a brief
period of lucidity, but the system has returned to its former dementia
and insanity. No rhyme or reason for the IP conflicts. Ditto the
ability or not to reach the bridge or the AP for reconfiguration (in
the connected-to-each-other, over-wifi-URL/web-based interface).

So, while I don't know that I complied with your demands to follow your
instructions (I don't know that I know enough to do it properly or as
desired, and I didn't see the posts about IP stuff), this is what I
*did* do, and how it worked and then didn't.

Physical Address: 00-11-09-16-F9-33
IP Address: 192.168.1.252
Subnet Mask: 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway: 192.168.1.1
DNS Server:
WINS Server:

That's what I see as connected right now - the IP is that of the "boat
AP", ditto the other stuff - from the "wireless connection status"
screen details section of the screen indicating my connection to 'boat
AP' with excellent signal strength, at 11mbps.

Going to dhcp configuration in my internal adapter yields a connection
to the unwanted AP - and since I can't get to the bridge to specify
which one I want, I'm stuck. Returning to the static state above
doesn't cure that.

This is the ipconfig /all for dhcp, with beacon being the closed
system; I can't get to the bridge to tell it to go to the proper SSID:

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /all

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : NavigationLaptop
Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Unknown
IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
DNS Suffix Search List. . . . . . : beaconwifi.lan

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : beaconwifi.lan
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : 802.11g MiniPCI Wireless
Network Ada
pter
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-11-09-16-F9-33
Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.121
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Wednesday, July 05, 2006
3:32:49 PM
Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Thursday, July 06, 2006
3:32:49 PM

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

Any other ideas/troubleshooting?

Thanks.

L8R

Skip, rebedding stanchion and ladder bases

>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
> John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
> Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
> Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

Hi, again.

Just powered the Senaos up again, in dhcp, and got this:

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

Windows IP Configuration


Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

Windows IP Configuration


Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . : beaconwifi.lan
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.121
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 10.0.2.1

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

This is the strongest signal; it's also a pay site. For the first
several minutes, I have not had an IP conflict. Now, let's try to
interrogate the bridge with a static IP (hawking adapter unplugged, in
case there's any possibility that's an IP conflict generator):

It came up with the SSID at "any" - I reset to 'sailing router' and got
a result of connected to 'non spec' and 44444444444 as the mac address.
Redoing the previous steps, I got the same result.

Reversing direction, going back to 'any' (blank address) and scanning
again, the scan sees all the correct places as well as 'boat AP' - the
2611 AP unit - which I assume it would now try to associate if I were
to do another reset. Yup.

Still in the internal adapter, in static mode so I can talk to the
bridge, again specifying 'sailing router' - the one I first succeeded
with: It first failed, then tried again, failing, yet again, with "The
server at 192.168.1.251 is taking too long to respond." A 'repair'
(windoze release/renew automation) failed to get me back in to the
bridge.

Returning to DHCP, I again showed 'boat AP' as excellent, but it would
not log in.
ipconfig release/renew failed.

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

Windows IP Configuration


Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

Windows IP Configuration

An error occurred while renewing interface Wireless Network Connection
: unable
to contact your DHCP server. Request has timed out.

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

Another 'repair' failed as well.

So, I don't know what we learn from this other than 'any' seems to be
the only way the bridge will communicate, now, and my access to the
bridge (through the AP) is flaky. Following these failures, going back
to static, attempting to access (if I can't associate the 'boat AP' I'm
not sure what I'll gain by it - hm. Lemme try the Hawking and see what
that association brings me: it started by quickly locking on, but then
not only would not bring up the "beacon" site, but gave me the message
of low or un-connectivity.), again, with another repair, again failed.

So, at this particular time, while I have no IP conflicts, I also have
no communication with 'boat AP' from either the built in or USB
adapters, having just reconnected the Hawking but failing to get the IP
despite nearly 100% signal strength and high-80s quality.

Reconnecting the Hawking adapter and asking for 'sailing router'
connected nearly immediately; here's the ipconfig on that (with the
Hawking USB adapter - "connection 25" - doing the talking):

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /all

Windows IP Configuration

Host Name . . . . . . . . . . . . : NavigationLaptop
Primary Dns Suffix . . . . . . . :
Node Type . . . . . . . . . . . . : Unknown
IP Routing Enabled. . . . . . . . : No
WINS Proxy Enabled. . . . . . . . : No

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : 802.11g MiniPCI Wireless
Network Adapter
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-11-09-16-F9-33

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
Description . . . . . . . . . . . : XPC 802.11b/g Wireless Kit
#3
Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-0E-3B-02-E9-B7
Dhcp Enabled. . . . . . . . . . . : Yes
Autoconfiguration Enabled . . . . : Yes
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.102
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1
DHCP Server . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1
DNS Servers . . . . . . . . . . . : 65.32.1.65
65.32.1.70
Lease Obtained. . . . . . . . . . : Thursday, July 06, 2006
9:08:44 AM
Lease Expires . . . . . . . . . . : Friday, July 07, 2006
9:08:44 AM

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /release

Windows IP Configuration

No operation can be performed on Wireless Network Connection while it
has its media disconnected.

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 0.0.0.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . :

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>ipconfig /renew

Windows IP Configuration

No operation can be performed on Wireless Network Connection while it
has its me
dia disconnected.

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection:

Media State . . . . . . . . . . . : Media disconnected

Ethernet adapter Wireless Network Connection 25:

Connection-specific DNS Suffix . :
IP Address. . . . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.102
Subnet Mask . . . . . . . . . . . : 255.255.255.0
Default Gateway . . . . . . . . . : 192.168.100.1

C:\DOCUME~1\REGIST~1.YOU>

For the 20 or so minutes I played with it before unplugging, again, I
got no IP conflicts - but can't communicate, either...

I started all this with the presumption that these units were
defective, or they should have worked as designed. I haven't changed
my mind.


L8R

Skip

Morgan 461 #2
SV Flying Pig KI4MPC
http://tinyurl.com/p7rb4 - NOTE:new URL! The vessel as Tehamana, as we
bought her

"Believe me, my young friend, there is *nothing*-absolutely
nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing,
messing-about-in-boats; messing about in boats-or *with* boats.
In or out of 'em, it doesn't matter. Nothing seems really to matter,
that's the charm of it.
Whether you get away, or whether you don't; whether you arrive at your
destination or whether you reach somewhere else, or whether you never
get anywhere at all, you're always busy, and you never do anything in
particular; and when you've done it there's always something else to
do, and you can do it if you like, but you'd much better not."

On 5 Jul 2006 12:40:41 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed) om>:

>Hi, John,
>
>John Navas wrote:
>> On 2 Jul 2006 06:49:00 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
>> Again, follow my last few responses to you. Pay particular attention to
>> IP address issues, written to address your particular problem, and now
>> part of the wiki.
>
>I must have missed those responses,

<http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=&scoring=d&as_oq=sailboat+skipgundlach &as_eq=&as_ugroup=alt.internet.wireless&as_usubjec t=&as_uauthors=john+navas>
or <http://tinyurl.com/oxahm>

>s I didn't see any which addressed
>IP issues.

<http://groups.google.com/group/alt.comp.hardware/msg/7a941dd3f51870ea?hl=en>

>And, as you may have seen in the firmware download post,
>I'm not really sure what I have.

Then get and flash the proper firmware.

>However, here's an update on what I've been doing:

As I wrote previously:

If you want my help, stick to my step by step. If you want to keep
[thrashing] around with other stuff you'll have to do it without me.

Jeff likewise (and more clearly):

I've avoided trying to help you because frankly, I don't think you're
approaching the problem systematically. Each section of your wireless
maze needs to be individually tested before it is conglomerated into a
floating wireless LAN. Despite advice to disassemble the parts and
piece and test them, you've consistently tried to make it work as a
total system. That won't work (unless you're very lucky) and certainly
is useless for pointing the finger at the problem or the culprit.
Divide and conquer.

Read that again, carefully. It's very good advice.

For the amount of time I've spent thus far trying to help you, the
problem should have long since been solved. I just don't have the time
to wade through all the stuff you're posting and try to make some sense
of it.

>So, there you have it. Like "Sleepers" - the movie - there was a brief
>period of lucidity, but the system has returned to its former dementia
>and insanity. No rhyme or reason for the IP conflicts. Ditto the
>ability or not to reach the bridge or the AP for reconfiguration (in
>the connected-to-each-other, over-wifi-URL/web-based interface).

I disagree. I think you're probably making some basic mistake.
Unfortunately, I can't make sense of what you're posting, and you won't
follow my advice, so I can't really help you.

>So, while I don't know that I complied with your demands to follow your
>instructions (I don't know that I know enough to do it properly or as
>desired, and I didn't see the posts about IP stuff), this is what I
>*did* do, and how it worked and then didn't.

I'm making no demands. I'm asking you to work with me, taking it little
step by little step, but you've simply ignored that. If you don't
understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If you'd rather do it
your way, then good luck to you.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

dOn 6 Jul 2006 06:28:34 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed). com>:

>[HUGE SNIP]

I just don't have the time to wade through all the stuff you're posting
and try to make some sense of it. I've been asking you to work with me,
taking it little step by little step, but you've simply ignored me (and
Jeff). If you don't understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If
you'd rather do it your way, then good luck to you.

>I started all this with the presumption that these units were
>defective, or they should have worked as designed. I haven't changed
>my mind.

I disagree. I think you're probably making some basic mistakes.
Unfortunately, I can't make sense of what you're posting, and since you
won't follow my advice, I can't really help you.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

Hi, John, and any observers...

John Navas wrote:
> On 5 Jul 2006 12:40:41 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"

(clip)

> I'm making no demands. I'm asking you to work with me, taking it little
> step by little step, but you've simply ignored that. If you don't
> understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If you'd rather do it
> your way, then good luck to you.

It's clear that I don't even know enough to ask the right questions.
Every time I think I've directly followed your instructions I've been
castigated for failure to do so. That I didn't ask questions was a sign
I thought I understood your steps to follow - and reported back on the
results of executing (what I thought was) them.

Every time I've attempted to KISS - just one device, just one set of
parameters - it's apparently not sufficient, witness Jeff and your
agreement with his assessment.

My attempts to totally isolate any potential duplication of effort,
extraneous gear or other obfuscations, starting with factory defaults
and one single device, and executing (and reporting) the steps
specified was greeted with - as best as I understood it - No, not that
way, follow my instructions. Any attempts at further clarification or
repetition of the same tasks to attempt duplication of results met with
the same results on reporting.

Attempts to further isolate, by working from the computer out and
analyzing the success or failure of each segment through the 2611
itself are, again, apparently insufficient. I don't have a clue about
how to further break it down and isolate parts, operating alone (and, I
thought, not together as complained about before, recent events, with
partial successes notwithstanding).

So, I'm lost.

Sorry to bother you (all)...

L8R

Skip

>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
> John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
> Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
> Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

On 6 Jul 2006 16:59:01 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed) .com>:

>Hi, John, and any observers...
>
>John Navas wrote:
>> On 5 Jul 2006 12:40:41 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
>
>(clip)
>
>> I'm making no demands. I'm asking you to work with me, taking it little
>> step by little step, but you've simply ignored that. If you don't
>> understand what I'm asking, then ask questions. If you'd rather do it
>> your way, then good luck to you.
>
>It's clear that I don't even know enough to ask the right questions.
>Every time I think I've directly followed your instructions I've been
>castigated for failure to do so. That I didn't ask questions was a sign
>I thought I understood your steps to follow - and reported back on the
>results of executing (what I thought was) them.
>[SNIP]

As I wrote before:

Please, please, please don't fool around like this! Just do my step by
step. Don't add anything, futz with other gear, etc. Just get Senao #1
connected to a *remote* (not your own) access point on a valid channel
with good signal, and then get DHCP working. Remember the bit in my
prior reply about having two configurations, one (manual IP) where you
can talk to the Senao but not the Internet, and another (DHCP) where
you can talk to the Internet but not the Senao. Do you fully
understand the why of that?

To summarize:
1. Flash and configure Senao #1 as a client bridge.
2. Equip Senao #1 with an antenna.
3. Hook the computer to Senao #1 with an Ethernet cable.
4. Configure computer to configure Senao #1.
5. Browse to Senao #1 management interface.
6. Connect Senao #1 to known good remote wireless service.
7. Record & report all Senao #1 settings
8. Reconfigure computer for DHCP.
9. Note carefully what happens. Give it at least 2 minutes.
10. Record & report all computer settings (IPCONFIG /ALL).

No other hardware!
No other steps!
Nothing else!

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

Hi, John, and thanks for coming back. I know I try your patience.

One question before I proceed. That's because I believe I've done all
the steps you ask below - but I've not reported them here.

I cannot reliably connect to any other than one pay service (to which I
don't subscribe). For whatever reason, the bridge locks on to it when
in the 'any' (no specified SSID) mode, despite its being only the 3rd
stronges signal in the area. In the rare instances where I've been
able to specify and associate 'sailing router' (the one my Hawking
adapter associates at my command), when I do a release/renew, sometimes
the bridge comes up (renewed) with the pay site.

Other times, when I specifiy 'sailing router' I get the 'non-spec'
association, 44444444 mac and random channels, including 12. FWIW,
that's also true of any other of the scans' results, most of the time.

So, my question:

John Navas wrote:
> To summarize:
> 1. Flash and configure Senao #1 as a client bridge.
> 2. Equip Senao #1 with an antenna.
> 3. Hook the computer to Senao #1 with an Ethernet cable.
> 4. Configure computer to configure Senao #1.
> 5. Browse to Senao #1 management interface.
> 6. Connect Senao #1 to known good remote wireless service.
> 7. Record & report all Senao #1 settings
> 8. Reconfigure computer for DHCP.
> 9. Note carefully what happens. Give it at least 2 minutes.
> 10. Record & report all computer settings (IPCONFIG /ALL).
>
> No other hardware!
> No other steps!
> Nothing else!

Do you want me to associate the pay channel, even though I won't be
able to surf/mail/tracert, etc.? I *will* be able to ipconfig /all,
/release, /renew on that, and any attempt to surf presents a log-in
screen in whatever web browser I use.

I *may* even get lucky and have it be stable enough that it connects to
'sailing router' - it remained stable for an hour during the both-units
test I did which I reported - but I'm not holding my breath. Last
night, doing what you want, above, it did, and I was able to surf and
mail. But as quickly as I "release/renew"ed it locked back into the
pay site and over an hour of beating (power recycle, change SSID from
'any - nothing in the space - to something other than the pay site) on
it didn't succeed in reassociating the open site. Worse (making me
wonder about the viability of the unit), it began taking extremely long
to respond, and very frequently timed out the URL.

So, even though I won't be able to communicate (other than to do the
handshake), do you want the results of the association to the pay site?

Thanks.

L8R

Skip
>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
> John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
> Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
> Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>

On 7 Jul 2006 05:10:39 -0700, "Skip - Working on the boat"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
<(E-Mail Removed) .com>:

>Hi, John, and thanks for coming back. I know I try your patience.
>
>One question before I proceed. That's because I believe I've done all
>the steps you ask below - but I've not reported them here.
>
>I cannot reliably connect to any other than one pay service (to which I
>don't subscribe). For whatever reason, the bridge locks on to it when
>in the 'any' (no specified SSID) mode, despite its being only the 3rd
>stronges signal in the area.

Wi-Fi clients should ideally go for the *best* signal, which isn't
necessarily the *strongest* signal -- signal quality is affected by
other factors; e.g.,interference.

>In the rare instances where I've been
>able to specify and associate 'sailing router' (the one my Hawking
>adapter associates at my command),

I'm guessing the Hawking is a "g" client. (I don't know for sure
because you've never clearly identified it.) The Senao is a "b" client.
You *can't* compare them directly unless you put the Hawking in "b-only"
mode.

>when I do a release/renew, sometimes
>the bridge comes up (renewed) with the pay site.

What the heck is "sailing router"?! Is that the actual SSID? What is
the hardware and how is it configured? How strong is the signal?

>Other times, when I specifiy 'sailing router' I get the 'non-spec'
>association, 44444444 mac and random channels, including 12. FWIW,
>that's also true of any other of the scans' results, most of the time.

Sounds like Senao #1 firmware isn't USA spec. Very important to make
*sure* Senao #1 has the latest USA spec client bridge firmware.

>So, my question:
>
>John Navas wrote:
>> To summarize:
>> 1. Flash and configure Senao #1 as a client bridge.
>> 2. Equip Senao #1 with an antenna.
>> 3. Hook the computer to Senao #1 with an Ethernet cable.
>> 4. Configure computer to configure Senao #1.
>> 5. Browse to Senao #1 management interface.
>> 6. Connect Senao #1 to known good remote wireless service.
>> 7. Record & report all Senao #1 settings
>> 8. Reconfigure computer for DHCP.
>> 9. Note carefully what happens. Give it at least 2 minutes.
>> 10. Record & report all computer settings (IPCONFIG /ALL).
>>
>> No other hardware!
>> No other steps!
>> Nothing else!
>
>Do you want me to associate the pay channel, even though I won't be
>able to surf/mail/tracert, etc.? I *will* be able to ipconfig /all,
>/release, /renew on that, and any attempt to surf presents a log-in
>screen in whatever web browser I use.

So Senao #1 *is* working properly, except for the association and
non-USA channel issues. Good.

>I *may* even get lucky and have it be stable enough that it connects to
>'sailing router' - it remained stable for an hour during the both-units
>test I did which I reported - but I'm not holding my breath. Last
>night, doing what you want, above, it did, and I was able to surf and
>mail. But as quickly as I "release/renew"ed it locked back into the
>pay site

IPCONFIG on your computer won't affect Senao #1 (which is just a client
bridge), so you must be doing something else you're not telling us. Are
you actually doing something in the Senao #1 management interface? Is
that management interface configured to get an address from the remote
service by DHCP? Or are you configuring it manually?

>and over an hour of beating (power recycle, change SSID from
>'any - nothing in the space - to something other than the pay site) on
>it didn't succeed in reassociating the open site. Worse (making me
>wonder about the viability of the unit), it began taking extremely long
>to respond, and very frequently timed out the URL.

When that happens, try power cycling it.

It sounds like the signal from the open site ('sailing router'?) is poor
(at least as received by Senao #1). Do you have a good, solid antenna
connection on Senao #1? Does it report signal strength? (I don't care
what the Hawking says.)

>So, even though I won't be able to communicate (other than to do the
>handshake), do you want the results of the association to the pay site?

My suggestion is to concentrate on getting Senao #1 to work properly
when wired to your computer. Nothing else. Repeat: nothing else.

--
Best regards, FAQ for Wireless Internet: <http://Wireless.wikia.com>
John Navas FAQ for Wi-Fi: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi>
Wi-Fi How To: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_How_To>
Fixes to Wi-Fi Problems: <http://wireless.wikia.com/wiki/Wi-Fi_Fixes>