Re: Time Synchronisation without Internet Access or 3rd party time server

Please ignore - PSS have found a resolution for this.

Cheers,
Katherine

"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:...
> Hi all,
>
> I've just built a standalone network comprised of the following:
>
> Domain Controller
> - Windows Server 2003 (2003 forest functional level)
> - Exchange Server 2003 (native mode)
> - all FSMO roles
>
> Member Server (NOT DC)
> - Windows Server 2003
> - Sharepoint Portal Server 2003
> - Project Server 2003
> - SQL Server 2000
>
> Clients
> - Windows XP
> - Office 2003
>
> Everything seems to be happy, except the time synchronisation. There is
> absolutely no Internet connectivity allowed into this network, and the
> cabling etc precludes us from accessing the Internet anyway.
Additionally,
> they don't want to add a third party NTP server into the mix; they want a
> pure MS environment except for AV and backups.
>
> So, what I've done is this:
>
> - configured the AnnounceFlags registry key on the DC as per KB 816042.
> Then installed hotfix 830092.
> - the clients haven't been configured, so by default they're using the
> domain hierarchy and speaking to the PDC Emulator, which is of course the
> only DC.
> - the member server was configured using the following setting, which I
did
> on the advice of MS PSS:
> 1. w32tm /config /manualpeerlist:<ip address of DC>,0x8
> /syncfromflags:MANUAL
> 2. net stop w32time & net start w32time
> 3. w32tm /resync
>
> So, the DC has had a registry tweak, the member server has had a w32tm
> tweak, and the workstations haven't been touched. Three different
> configurations, and none of the machines are happy.
>
> On the DC I was receiving this error:
> Event ID 36:
> "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
86400
> seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
usable
> time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized and cannot provide the time
> to other clients or update the system clock."
>
> On the member server I was receiving this error:
> Event ID 50:
> "The time service detected a time difference of greater than 5000
> milliseconds for 900 seconds. The time difference might be caused by
> synchronization with low-accuracy time sources or by suboptimal network
> conditions. The time service is no longer synchronized and cannot provide
> the time to other clients or update the system clock. When a valid time
> stamp is received from a time service provider, the time service will
> correct itself."
>
> On the workstations I was receiving this error:
> Event ID 36:
> "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
49152
> seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
usable
> time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized."
>
> PSS then recommended that I configure each machine (including the PDC
> Emulator) with run net time/setsntp:<name of PDC Emulator> and then
restart
> the w32time service. I did this, but as per KB 816042, this results in
> errors 38, 47 and 29 on the PDC, which basically state that the PDC is
> receiving invalid time data, that no valid response has been received
after
> 8 attempts and that none of the valid sources are currently available.
>
> So, it appears that none of the machines are happy with the current time
> synchronisation configuration. Has anyone else managed to get time
> synchronisation working happily in an environment with no Internet
> connectivity and with no dedicated third party time server?? As I
> mentioned, I've logged a call with PSS but they're receiving errors 36 as
> well, so it seems that the solution given in KB 816042 isn't really a
> workable solution at all.
>
> Any ideas??
> Katherine Coombs
>
>

Can you share the solution with us?

Thanks
Ninon

"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Please ignore - PSS have found a resolution for this.
>
> Cheers,
> Katherine
>
> "Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
message
> news:...
> > Hi all,
> >
> > I've just built a standalone network comprised of the following:
> >
> > Domain Controller
> > - Windows Server 2003 (2003 forest functional level)
> > - Exchange Server 2003 (native mode)
> > - all FSMO roles
> >
> > Member Server (NOT DC)
> > - Windows Server 2003
> > - Sharepoint Portal Server 2003
> > - Project Server 2003
> > - SQL Server 2000
> >
> > Clients
> > - Windows XP
> > - Office 2003
> >
> > Everything seems to be happy, except the time synchronisation. There is
> > absolutely no Internet connectivity allowed into this network, and the
> > cabling etc precludes us from accessing the Internet anyway.
> Additionally,
> > they don't want to add a third party NTP server into the mix; they want
a
> > pure MS environment except for AV and backups.
> >
> > So, what I've done is this:
> >
> > - configured the AnnounceFlags registry key on the DC as per KB 816042.
> > Then installed hotfix 830092.
> > - the clients haven't been configured, so by default they're using the
> > domain hierarchy and speaking to the PDC Emulator, which is of course
the
> > only DC.
> > - the member server was configured using the following setting, which I
> did
> > on the advice of MS PSS:
> > 1. w32tm /config /manualpeerlist:<ip address of DC>,0x8
> > /syncfromflags:MANUAL
> > 2. net stop w32time & net start w32time
> > 3. w32tm /resync
> >
> > So, the DC has had a registry tweak, the member server has had a w32tm
> > tweak, and the workstations haven't been touched. Three different
> > configurations, and none of the machines are happy.
> >
> > On the DC I was receiving this error:
> > Event ID 36:
> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
> 86400
> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
> usable
> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized and cannot provide the
time
> > to other clients or update the system clock."
> >
> > On the member server I was receiving this error:
> > Event ID 50:
> > "The time service detected a time difference of greater than 5000
> > milliseconds for 900 seconds. The time difference might be caused by
> > synchronization with low-accuracy time sources or by suboptimal network
> > conditions. The time service is no longer synchronized and cannot
provide
> > the time to other clients or update the system clock. When a valid time
> > stamp is received from a time service provider, the time service will
> > correct itself."
> >
> > On the workstations I was receiving this error:
> > Event ID 36:
> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
> 49152
> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
> usable
> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized."
> >
> > PSS then recommended that I configure each machine (including the PDC
> > Emulator) with run net time/setsntp:<name of PDC Emulator> and then
> restart
> > the w32time service. I did this, but as per KB 816042, this results in
> > errors 38, 47 and 29 on the PDC, which basically state that the PDC is
> > receiving invalid time data, that no valid response has been received
> after
> > 8 attempts and that none of the valid sources are currently available.
> >
> > So, it appears that none of the machines are happy with the current time
> > synchronisation configuration. Has anyone else managed to get time
> > synchronisation working happily in an environment with no Internet
> > connectivity and with no dedicated third party time server?? As I
> > mentioned, I've logged a call with PSS but they're receiving errors 36
as
> > well, so it seems that the solution given in KB 816042 isn't really a
> > workable solution at all.
> >
> > Any ideas??
> > Katherine Coombs
> >
> >
>
>

See tip 8266 in the 'Tips & Tricks' at http://www.jsiinc.com

On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:19:14 -0400, "Ninon Chassé" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>Can you share the solution with us?
>
>Thanks
>Ninon
>
>"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>> Please ignore - PSS have found a resolution for this.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Katherine
>>
>> "Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>message
>> news:...
>> > Hi all,
>> >
>> > I've just built a standalone network comprised of the following:
>> >
>> > Domain Controller
>> > - Windows Server 2003 (2003 forest functional level)
>> > - Exchange Server 2003 (native mode)
>> > - all FSMO roles
>> >
>> > Member Server (NOT DC)
>> > - Windows Server 2003
>> > - Sharepoint Portal Server 2003
>> > - Project Server 2003
>> > - SQL Server 2000
>> >
>> > Clients
>> > - Windows XP
>> > - Office 2003
>> >
>> > Everything seems to be happy, except the time synchronisation. There is
>> > absolutely no Internet connectivity allowed into this network, and the
>> > cabling etc precludes us from accessing the Internet anyway.
>> Additionally,
>> > they don't want to add a third party NTP server into the mix; they want
>a
>> > pure MS environment except for AV and backups.
>> >
>> > So, what I've done is this:
>> >
>> > - configured the AnnounceFlags registry key on the DC as per KB 816042.
>> > Then installed hotfix 830092.
>> > - the clients haven't been configured, so by default they're using the
>> > domain hierarchy and speaking to the PDC Emulator, which is of course
>the
>> > only DC.
>> > - the member server was configured using the following setting, which I
>> did
>> > on the advice of MS PSS:
>> > 1. w32tm /config /manualpeerlist:<ip address of DC>,0x8
>> > /syncfromflags:MANUAL
>> > 2. net stop w32time & net start w32time
>> > 3. w32tm /resync
>> >
>> > So, the DC has had a registry tweak, the member server has had a w32tm
>> > tweak, and the workstations haven't been touched. Three different
>> > configurations, and none of the machines are happy.
>> >
>> > On the DC I was receiving this error:
>> > Event ID 36:
>> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
>> 86400
>> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
>> usable
>> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized and cannot provide the
>time
>> > to other clients or update the system clock."
>> >
>> > On the member server I was receiving this error:
>> > Event ID 50:
>> > "The time service detected a time difference of greater than 5000
>> > milliseconds for 900 seconds. The time difference might be caused by
>> > synchronization with low-accuracy time sources or by suboptimal network
>> > conditions. The time service is no longer synchronized and cannot
>provide
>> > the time to other clients or update the system clock. When a valid time
>> > stamp is received from a time service provider, the time service will
>> > correct itself."
>> >
>> > On the workstations I was receiving this error:
>> > Event ID 36:
>> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time for
>> 49152
>> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
>> usable
>> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized."
>> >
>> > PSS then recommended that I configure each machine (including the PDC
>> > Emulator) with run net time/setsntp:<name of PDC Emulator> and then
>> restart
>> > the w32time service. I did this, but as per KB 816042, this results in
>> > errors 38, 47 and 29 on the PDC, which basically state that the PDC is
>> > receiving invalid time data, that no valid response has been received
>> after
>> > 8 attempts and that none of the valid sources are currently available.
>> >
>> > So, it appears that none of the machines are happy with the current time
>> > synchronisation configuration. Has anyone else managed to get time
>> > synchronisation working happily in an environment with no Internet
>> > connectivity and with no dedicated third party time server?? As I
>> > mentioned, I've logged a call with PSS but they're receiving errors 36
>as
>> > well, so it seems that the solution given in KB 816042 isn't really a
>> > workable solution at all.
>> >
>> > Any ideas??
>> > Katherine Coombs
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>


Jerold Schulman
Windows: General MVP
JSI, Inc.
http://www.jsiinc.com

Jerold,

That tip is KB 816042, which didn't work as per my original post. PSS have
acknowledged that implementing that solution in their test environment
caused them problems, too, so I'm confident that it wasn't just my system.

In the end, I did as follows:

On Domain Controller:
-ran w32tm /register - set time values to default
-ran w32tm /config /reliable:yes - sets announceflags to 5 in the registry.

-Set Enabled to 0 (No) in the following registry path -
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Servic es\W32Time\TimeProviders\N
tpClient This entry indicates if the NtpClient provider is enabled in
the current Time Service.

-ran w32tm /config /update

-Stopped and started w32time service.

Result: No events logged on DC.



On clients and member servers:

Stopped and started w32time service on client.

Result: Event ID 35 logged (indicating that the time is synchronising)



It's been a day now and still no problems, so this solution appears to have
fixed my problems and should work in similar environment.



Hope this helps,

Katherine

"Jerold Schulman" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
>
> See tip 8266 in the 'Tips & Tricks' at http://www.jsiinc.com
>
> On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:19:14 -0400, "Ninon Chassé"
<(E-Mail Removed)>
> wrote:
>
> >Can you share the solution with us?
> >
> >Thanks
> >Ninon
> >
> >"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
message
> >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> >> Please ignore - PSS have found a resolution for this.
> >>
> >> Cheers,
> >> Katherine
> >>
> >> "Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> >message
> >> news:...
> >> > Hi all,
> >> >
> >> > I've just built a standalone network comprised of the following:
> >> >
> >> > Domain Controller
> >> > - Windows Server 2003 (2003 forest functional level)
> >> > - Exchange Server 2003 (native mode)
> >> > - all FSMO roles
> >> >
> >> > Member Server (NOT DC)
> >> > - Windows Server 2003
> >> > - Sharepoint Portal Server 2003
> >> > - Project Server 2003
> >> > - SQL Server 2000
> >> >
> >> > Clients
> >> > - Windows XP
> >> > - Office 2003
> >> >
> >> > Everything seems to be happy, except the time synchronisation. There
is
> >> > absolutely no Internet connectivity allowed into this network, and
the
> >> > cabling etc precludes us from accessing the Internet anyway.
> >> Additionally,
> >> > they don't want to add a third party NTP server into the mix; they
want
> >a
> >> > pure MS environment except for AV and backups.
> >> >
> >> > So, what I've done is this:
> >> >
> >> > - configured the AnnounceFlags registry key on the DC as per KB
816042.
> >> > Then installed hotfix 830092.
> >> > - the clients haven't been configured, so by default they're using
the
> >> > domain hierarchy and speaking to the PDC Emulator, which is of course
> >the
> >> > only DC.
> >> > - the member server was configured using the following setting, which
I
> >> did
> >> > on the advice of MS PSS:
> >> > 1. w32tm /config /manualpeerlist:<ip address of DC>,0x8
> >> > /syncfromflags:MANUAL
> >> > 2. net stop w32time & net start w32time
> >> > 3. w32tm /resync
> >> >
> >> > So, the DC has had a registry tweak, the member server has had a
w32tm
> >> > tweak, and the workstations haven't been touched. Three different
> >> > configurations, and none of the machines are happy.
> >> >
> >> > On the DC I was receiving this error:
> >> > Event ID 36:
> >> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time
for
> >> 86400
> >> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
> >> usable
> >> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized and cannot provide the
> >time
> >> > to other clients or update the system clock."
> >> >
> >> > On the member server I was receiving this error:
> >> > Event ID 50:
> >> > "The time service detected a time difference of greater than 5000
> >> > milliseconds for 900 seconds. The time difference might be caused by
> >> > synchronization with low-accuracy time sources or by suboptimal
network
> >> > conditions. The time service is no longer synchronized and cannot
> >provide
> >> > the time to other clients or update the system clock. When a valid
time
> >> > stamp is received from a time service provider, the time service will
> >> > correct itself."
> >> >
> >> > On the workstations I was receiving this error:
> >> > Event ID 36:
> >> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time
for
> >> 49152
> >> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide a
> >> usable
> >> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized."
> >> >
> >> > PSS then recommended that I configure each machine (including the PDC
> >> > Emulator) with run net time/setsntp:<name of PDC Emulator> and then
> >> restart
> >> > the w32time service. I did this, but as per KB 816042, this results
in
> >> > errors 38, 47 and 29 on the PDC, which basically state that the PDC
is
> >> > receiving invalid time data, that no valid response has been received
> >> after
> >> > 8 attempts and that none of the valid sources are currently
available.
> >> >
> >> > So, it appears that none of the machines are happy with the current
time
> >> > synchronisation configuration. Has anyone else managed to get time
> >> > synchronisation working happily in an environment with no Internet
> >> > connectivity and with no dedicated third party time server?? As I
> >> > mentioned, I've logged a call with PSS but they're receiving errors
36
> >as
> >> > well, so it seems that the solution given in KB 816042 isn't really a
> >> > workable solution at all.
> >> >
> >> > Any ideas??
> >> > Katherine Coombs
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> Jerold Schulman
> Windows: General MVP
> JSI, Inc.
> http://www.jsiinc.com

Thank you Katherine!

Ninon

"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:u%(E-Mail Removed)...
> Jerold,
>
> That tip is KB 816042, which didn't work as per my original post. PSS
have
> acknowledged that implementing that solution in their test environment
> caused them problems, too, so I'm confident that it wasn't just my system.
>
> In the end, I did as follows:
>
> On Domain Controller:
> -ran w32tm /register - set time values to default
> -ran w32tm /config /reliable:yes - sets announceflags to 5 in the
registry.
>
> -Set Enabled to 0 (No) in the following registry path -
>
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Servic es\W32Time\TimeProviders\N
> tpClient This entry indicates if the NtpClient provider is enabled in
> the current Time Service.
>
> -ran w32tm /config /update
>
> -Stopped and started w32time service.
>
> Result: No events logged on DC.
>
>
>
> On clients and member servers:
>
> Stopped and started w32time service on client.
>
> Result: Event ID 35 logged (indicating that the time is synchronising)
>
>
>
> It's been a day now and still no problems, so this solution appears to
have
> fixed my problems and should work in similar environment.
>
>
>
> Hope this helps,
>
> Katherine
>
> "Jerold Schulman" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> >
> >
> > See tip 8266 in the 'Tips & Tricks' at http://www.jsiinc.com
> >
> > On Tue, 10 Aug 2004 09:19:14 -0400, "Ninon Chassé"
> <(E-Mail Removed)>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >Can you share the solution with us?
> > >
> > >Thanks
> > >Ninon
> > >
> > >"Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message
> > >news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > >> Please ignore - PSS have found a resolution for this.
> > >>
> > >> Cheers,
> > >> Katherine
> > >>
> > >> "Katherine Coombs" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> > >message
> > >> news:...
> > >> > Hi all,
> > >> >
> > >> > I've just built a standalone network comprised of the following:
> > >> >
> > >> > Domain Controller
> > >> > - Windows Server 2003 (2003 forest functional level)
> > >> > - Exchange Server 2003 (native mode)
> > >> > - all FSMO roles
> > >> >
> > >> > Member Server (NOT DC)
> > >> > - Windows Server 2003
> > >> > - Sharepoint Portal Server 2003
> > >> > - Project Server 2003
> > >> > - SQL Server 2000
> > >> >
> > >> > Clients
> > >> > - Windows XP
> > >> > - Office 2003
> > >> >
> > >> > Everything seems to be happy, except the time synchronisation.
There
> is
> > >> > absolutely no Internet connectivity allowed into this network, and
> the
> > >> > cabling etc precludes us from accessing the Internet anyway.
> > >> Additionally,
> > >> > they don't want to add a third party NTP server into the mix; they
> want
> > >a
> > >> > pure MS environment except for AV and backups.
> > >> >
> > >> > So, what I've done is this:
> > >> >
> > >> > - configured the AnnounceFlags registry key on the DC as per KB
> 816042.
> > >> > Then installed hotfix 830092.
> > >> > - the clients haven't been configured, so by default they're using
> the
> > >> > domain hierarchy and speaking to the PDC Emulator, which is of
course
> > >the
> > >> > only DC.
> > >> > - the member server was configured using the following setting,
which
> I
> > >> did
> > >> > on the advice of MS PSS:
> > >> > 1. w32tm /config /manualpeerlist:<ip address of DC>,0x8
> > >> > /syncfromflags:MANUAL
> > >> > 2. net stop w32time & net start w32time
> > >> > 3. w32tm /resync
> > >> >
> > >> > So, the DC has had a registry tweak, the member server has had a
> w32tm
> > >> > tweak, and the workstations haven't been touched. Three different
> > >> > configurations, and none of the machines are happy.
> > >> >
> > >> > On the DC I was receiving this error:
> > >> > Event ID 36:
> > >> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time
> for
> > >> 86400
> > >> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide
a
> > >> usable
> > >> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized and cannot provide
the
> > >time
> > >> > to other clients or update the system clock."
> > >> >
> > >> > On the member server I was receiving this error:
> > >> > Event ID 50:
> > >> > "The time service detected a time difference of greater than 5000
> > >> > milliseconds for 900 seconds. The time difference might be caused
by
> > >> > synchronization with low-accuracy time sources or by suboptimal
> network
> > >> > conditions. The time service is no longer synchronized and cannot
> > >provide
> > >> > the time to other clients or update the system clock. When a valid
> time
> > >> > stamp is received from a time service provider, the time service
will
> > >> > correct itself."
> > >> >
> > >> > On the workstations I was receiving this error:
> > >> > Event ID 36:
> > >> > "The time service has not been able to synchronize the system time
> for
> > >> 49152
> > >> > seconds because none of the time providers has been able to provide
a
> > >> usable
> > >> > time stamp. The system clock is unsynchronized."
> > >> >
> > >> > PSS then recommended that I configure each machine (including the
PDC
> > >> > Emulator) with run net time/setsntp:<name of PDC Emulator> and then
> > >> restart
> > >> > the w32time service. I did this, but as per KB 816042, this
results
> in
> > >> > errors 38, 47 and 29 on the PDC, which basically state that the PDC
> is
> > >> > receiving invalid time data, that no valid response has been
received
> > >> after
> > >> > 8 attempts and that none of the valid sources are currently
> available.
> > >> >
> > >> > So, it appears that none of the machines are happy with the current
> time
> > >> > synchronisation configuration. Has anyone else managed to get time
> > >> > synchronisation working happily in an environment with no Internet
> > >> > connectivity and with no dedicated third party time server?? As I
> > >> > mentioned, I've logged a call with PSS but they're receiving errors
> 36
> > >as
> > >> > well, so it seems that the solution given in KB 816042 isn't really
a
> > >> > workable solution at all.
> > >> >
> > >> > Any ideas??
> > >> > Katherine Coombs
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> > Jerold Schulman
> > Windows: General MVP
> > JSI, Inc.
> > http://www.jsiinc.com
>
>