MN-700 Support

After looking at the support pages at
http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifeselecthardware I'm curious as to whether
the MN-700 is still supposed to be supported. According to the pages at
http://support.microsoft.com/lifecyc...en-us&x=17&y=8 it appears that
perhaps it should still be supported.
http://support.microsoft.com/lifecyc...s+base+station

However, I believe that Chris H. mentioned that Microsoft has disbanded the
wireless networking group. My question is; how can Microsoft claim support
if they don't even have the developers available to update the firmware in
the case of a security bug?

Is MS listening???? I like my MN-700 and the 3 MN-720s that I bought, but
I'm concerned that there will no longer be any firmware updates to address
security problems!

Lastly, does anyone know if the MN-700 firmware is based upon the Windows CE
core or if not, what it is based upon?

Thanks

-Pete

They are supported insofar as warranty replacements.
The MN700 is suppose to be powered by Windows CE.

--
Jason Tsang - Microsoft MVP

Find out about the MS MVP Program -
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx

"Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:%(E-Mail Removed)...
> After looking at the support pages at
> http://support.microsoft.com/gp/lifeselecthardware I'm curious as to
> whether the MN-700 is still supposed to be supported. According to the
> pages at http://support.microsoft.com/lifecyc...en-us&x=17&y=8 it
> appears that perhaps it should still be supported.
> http://support.microsoft.com/lifecyc...s+base+station
>
> However, I believe that Chris H. mentioned that Microsoft has disbanded
> the wireless networking group. My question is; how can Microsoft claim
> support if they don't even have the developers available to update the
> firmware in the case of a security bug?
>
> Is MS listening???? I like my MN-700 and the 3 MN-720s that I bought, but
> I'm concerned that there will no longer be any firmware updates to address
> security problems!
>
> Lastly, does anyone know if the MN-700 firmware is based upon the Windows
> CE core or if not, what it is based upon?
>
> Thanks
>
> -Pete
>

"Jason Tsang" <jason-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:%(E-Mail Removed)...
> They are supported insofar as warranty replacements.
> The MN700 is suppose to be powered by Windows CE.

Jason,
I don't know if you actually looked at the links I provided, but the last
one indicates that "mainstream support", not warranty replacement, will end
12/31/2007. This indicates to me that Microsoft is aware that they should
still be supporting this product. Support is something far different than
warranty replacement. As to whether support indicates that the product
firmware should be updated, I don't know... but at least we should still be
able to get tech support for the product until the end of 2007.

-Pete

With no MSBBN team in existence anymore, I would be shocked if there was any
updated firmware in the future...

If you choose to be optimistic, that's up to you, but with no team behind
the product.. it's my opinion that it'd take a real miracle for you to see
any updated firmware.

--
Jason Tsang - Microsoft MVP

Find out about the MS MVP Program -
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx

"Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:%(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> "Jason Tsang" <jason-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:%(E-Mail Removed)...
>> They are supported insofar as warranty replacements.
>> The MN700 is suppose to be powered by Windows CE.
>
> Jason,
> I don't know if you actually looked at the links I provided, but the last
> one indicates that "mainstream support", not warranty replacement, will
> end 12/31/2007. This indicates to me that Microsoft is aware that they
> should still be supporting this product. Support is something far
> different than warranty replacement. As to whether support indicates that
> the product firmware should be updated, I don't know... but at least we
> should still be able to get tech support for the product until the end of
> 2007.
>
> -Pete
>

"Jason Tsang" <jason-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> With no MSBBN team in existence anymore, I would be shocked if there was
> any updated firmware in the future...
>
> If you choose to be optimistic, that's up to you, but with no team behind
> the product.. it's my opinion that it'd take a real miracle for you to
> see any updated firmware.

Jason,
It's not that I'm optimistic. I just don't see how MS can justify having
the web site claim support for the product when in fact it is dead as far as
security updates go. I think that the MS products were generally quite
good, but had a few bugs that could have been worked out. In addition, if
you look at the product warranty there is some interesting language in it
that could make MS financially liable to customers in some situations.
Perhaps that is why the sham of "support but no updates" continues.Of
course, I am no lawyer so I just interpret the language as a mere mortal
would...

When I bought the product it was with the assumption that MS would make good
on thier hardware support promise to the customers.Would people buy Windows
if the stated support models weren't followed?

In addition, I wish the code base was available to developers with a source
code license or MS partners so we could modify/fix it... Sadly, all there
appear to be are hacks that get it working with alternate firmware such as:
http://wl500g.info/archive/index.php/t-1616.html and they don't seem to be
as reliable as the OEM firmware.

I personally would prefer to stay with the CE code base as it has matured
nicely anyway.

Oh well, I suppose it can't hurt to voice my complaints! I still use the
product and will do so until there is something wrong that I can't work
around, because for me, this stuff has always "just worked".

-Pete

WPA in the MN700 made it too slow. The horsepower is not there to
support WPA2 let alone WPA original.

On Sat, 18 Feb 2006 05:09:08 -0500, "Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>Perhaps that is why the sham of "support but no updates" continues.Of
>course, I am no lawyer so I just interpret the language as a mere mortal
>would...
--

Barb Bowman
MS Windows-MVP
Expert Zone Columnist
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/e...ts/bowman.mspx
http://blogs.digitalmediaphile.com/barb/

There was a reason the MN700 didn't even get certified as a WPA compatible
device by the WiFi alliance... to think it could even do WPA2... laughable
given it couldn't even do the former <g>

To the OP (Pete), if you want better security support, then you need a more
powerful router. It's as simple as that.

--
Jason Tsang - Microsoft MVP

Find out about the MS MVP Program -
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/default.aspx

"Barb Bowman MVP-Windows" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> WPA in the MN700 made it too slow. The horsepower is not there to
> support WPA2 let alone WPA original.
>
> On Sat, 18 Feb 2006 05:09:08 -0500, "Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)>
> wrote:
>
>>Perhaps that is why the sham of "support but no updates" continues.Of
>>course, I am no lawyer so I just interpret the language as a mere mortal
>>would...
> --
>
> Barb Bowman
> MS Windows-MVP
> Expert Zone Columnist
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/e...ts/bowman.mspx
> http://blogs.digitalmediaphile.com/barb/

"Jason Tsang" <jason-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:%23Vud%(E-Mail Removed)...
> There was a reason the MN700 didn't even get certified as a WPA compatible
> device by the WiFi alliance... to think it could even do WPA2...
> laughable given it couldn't even do the former <g>
>
> To the OP (Pete), if you want better security support, then you need a
> more powerful router. It's as simple as that.

Jason,
I am not looking for better security support, only for a commitment to
fixing the bugs in the current product. No new features required!
Certainly I'll have to upgrade at some point since I'm running Media Center
PCs all over the house and I only have the MS wireless at this point and I
want the increased bandwidth and security of some of the new routers, but
for now I would simply like the assurance that if there is a security hole
in the product that I will be notified and that it will be fixed.

PS: As an MVP don't you have access to the Windows CE source via the shared
source agreement?

-Pete

We couldn't alter the code, even if we had access to it. If you're running
MCE machines, you really should have 802.11a access for wireless
performance. Or wired directly. None of Microsoft's products ever
supported 802.11a and it is no wonder they didn't want to continue making
them.
--
Chris H.
Microsoft Windows MVP/Tablet PC
Tablet Creations - http://nicecreations.us/
Associate Expert
Expert Zone - www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/expertzone


"Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> "Jason Tsang" <jason-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:%23Vud%(E-Mail Removed)...
>> There was a reason the MN700 didn't even get certified as a WPA
>> compatible device by the WiFi alliance... to think it could even do
>> WPA2... laughable given it couldn't even do the former <g>
>>
>> To the OP (Pete), if you want better security support, then you need a
>> more powerful router. It's as simple as that.
>
> Jason,
> I am not looking for better security support, only for a commitment to
> fixing the bugs in the current product. No new features required!
> Certainly I'll have to upgrade at some point since I'm running Media
> Center PCs all over the house and I only have the MS wireless at this
> point and I want the increased bandwidth and security of some of the new
> routers, but for now I would simply like the assurance that if there is a
> security hole in the product that I will be notified and that it will be
> fixed.
>
> PS: As an MVP don't you have access to the Windows CE source via the
> shared source agreement?
>
> -Pete
>

FWIW, I don't think any vendor of residential wireless hardware
notifies customers of security issues. If there were a huge issue
where no work around were available (and not being a lawyer, I would
not presume to engage in a debate on whether turning off features was
a "fix"), it would be unlikely that MS could even contract out
development of a fix for a router that today does not meet the
qualifications for WiFi certification. They'd more likes declare it
end of life on the day something that serious was discovered.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that what has happened is what
should have happened, but it was a business decision.



On Sat, 18 Feb 2006 15:17:05 -0500, "Pete Delgado" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>for now I would simply like the assurance that if there is a security hole
>in the product that I will be notified and that it will be fixed.
--

Barb Bowman
MS Windows-MVP
Expert Zone Columnist
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/e...ts/bowman.mspx
http://blogs.digitalmediaphile.com/barb/