HELP! network novice

I would like to set up a wireless network between my desktop and laptop
computer but I am a complete beginner when it comes to networking, I have
had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and Curry's that I
don't know where to start.

I have a Medion desktop running XP with a 10/100 Ethernet socket on the
back, I have an E Machine laptop with built in WiFi and a Belkin wireless
Router, I am connected to Freeserve Broadband.

First of all, my desktop is the main computer which sits next to the USB
modem and phone line, can I connect my dtop to the router using just a cable
or will I have to buy a desktop wireless network card, some of the experts
in PC world say no, experts in Dixons say yes.
Can any of you good people point me in the right direction, I have to
teenage daughters, (there bloody computers) waiting for me to set it up so
they can both go on line at the same time.

Secondly, just how easy is a wireless network to set up, I read in Computer
Active that it can be tricky, (I don't like tricky) can I end up loosing all
my settings for the internet, how does a router work, will the kids ever
stop staring at me with a look of utter disappointment on there faces.

If anyone can help me out they will have the pleasure of knowing they have
saved the relationship between a Father and his Daughters

Thank you thank you thank you in advance

Desperate Dad

Jim


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004

Sorry, forgot to mention, router is still in the box with the cellophane
wrapped around it, have had it for nearly two weeks now, but did not want to
open it in case it had to go back, when I said novice, I meant it

Kind Regards

Jim


"Jim" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:c0aj26$7qo$(E-Mail Removed)...
> I would like to set up a wireless network between my desktop and laptop
> computer but I am a complete beginner when it comes to networking, I have
> had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and Curry's that
I
> don't know where to start.
>
> I have a Medion desktop running XP with a 10/100 Ethernet socket on the
> back, I have an E Machine laptop with built in WiFi and a Belkin wireless
> Router, I am connected to Freeserve Broadband.
>
> First of all, my desktop is the main computer which sits next to the USB
> modem and phone line, can I connect my dtop to the router using just a
cable
> or will I have to buy a desktop wireless network card, some of the experts
> in PC world say no, experts in Dixons say yes.
> Can any of you good people point me in the right direction, I have to
> teenage daughters, (there bloody computers) waiting for me to set it up so
> they can both go on line at the same time.
>
> Secondly, just how easy is a wireless network to set up, I read in
Computer
> Active that it can be tricky, (I don't like tricky) can I end up loosing
all
> my settings for the internet, how does a router work, will the kids ever
> stop staring at me with a look of utter disappointment on there faces.
>
> If anyone can help me out they will have the pleasure of knowing they have
> saved the relationship between a Father and his Daughters
>
> Thank you thank you thank you in advance
>
> Desperate Dad
>
> Jim
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004

In article <c0aj26$7qo$(E-Mail Removed)>, Jim wrote:
> I would like to set up a wireless network between my desktop and laptop
> computer but I am a complete beginner when it comes to networking, I have
> had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and Curry's that I
> don't know where to start.

Forget anything you have been told from these sources, it's almost certainly
wrong.

> I have a Medion desktop running XP with a 10/100 Ethernet socket on the
> back

That bit's good....

, I have an E Machine laptop with built in WiFi

and that bit

> and a Belkin wireless Router

Where did this come from? Assuming it is the correct router (ie for use with
a USB modem) then the modem will plug into it directly via a USB port. If it
has ports for a wired connection (likely) then you don't need a wireless card
for the desktop, just connect it directly with some CAT5 cable. If it's too
far away, then you can go wireless instead - but then you will need a wireless
card for the desktop. Is there a picture of the router that you tell one way
or another? Failing that, what's the model number?

> Secondly, just how easy is a wireless network to set up, I read in Computer
> Active that it can be tricky,

Not really. In a perfect world: Turn on the router, laptop immediately
detects the connection, it works, you resist the temptation to leave it alone
as it now works for everyone in the street, so you need to do a bit of
fiddling to ensure only you and your girls can use it - which means enable WEP
or WPA encryption, change the default SSID and don't broadcast it. This is
not actually that difficult, but it's a lot easier to show than describe.
You'll probably have to log into the router to do this, and it'll probably
have a web interface that makes it straightforward.

> (I don't like tricky) can I end up loosing all
> my settings for the internet

Make sure you know your login name and password, everything else can be
reinstated....

> How does a router work

You don't want or need to know :-) But it's a lot cleverer than a hub or a
switch, which in practice means it's easier to set up as it tells the machines
connected to it what they need to know.

> If anyone can help me out they will have the pleasure of knowing they have
> saved the relationship between a Father and his Daughters

I'm a sucker for father/daughter relationships. If this doesn't give you some
confidence let me know and I'll try and help you through it. I'm not an
expert (software is my thing), but I have laboured through this a couple of
times....

--

F

>> have had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and
>> Curry's that I don't know where to start.
>
> Forget anything you have been told from these sources, it's almost
> certainly wrong.

Thats the best bit of advice you will get !!

Dave

Ferger

First of all, apologies for this reply, I am not up to speed with snipping,
and I know your not sposed to top post, God I know more than I realised.
Secondly, thank you for the reply, I can feel the confidence starting to
surge through my veins, the kids are looking on with eager
anticipation.....................................w ill sleep on it and give
it a go tomorrow.
I have had a good look at the router box and it does not mention a USB
connection, any way, here is a photo of the router, copyright of those
wonderfully helpful people at PC World
http://www.pcworld.co.uk/martprd/sto...ID=@@@@1802433
337.1076448925@@@@&BV_EngineID=cccfadckjhfjffkcflg ceggdhhmdfhl.0&page=Produc
t&sku=886496&category_oid=-9984&fm=null&sm=null&tm=null
I was told this was the router I needed when the girls picked there laptop
All the other info you have supplied is 500% more than our friendly store
supplied, and probably 10000% more accurate, after looking at the router, if
there is any more info you can give me, it will be gratefully accepted.

Many thanks, this could get me some cred back with my two offspring

Cheers

Jim


"Ferger" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> In article <c0aj26$7qo$(E-Mail Removed)>, Jim wrote:
> > I would like to set up a wireless network between my desktop and laptop
> > computer but I am a complete beginner when it comes to networking, I
have
> > had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and Curry's
that I
> > don't know where to start.
>
> Forget anything you have been told from these sources, it's almost
certainly
> wrong.
>
> > I have a Medion desktop running XP with a 10/100 Ethernet socket on the
> > back
>
> That bit's good....
>
> , I have an E Machine laptop with built in WiFi
>
> and that bit
>
> > and a Belkin wireless Router
>
> Where did this come from? Assuming it is the correct router (ie for use
with
> a USB modem) then the modem will plug into it directly via a USB port. If
it
> has ports for a wired connection (likely) then you don't need a wireless
card
> for the desktop, just connect it directly with some CAT5 cable. If it's
too
> far away, then you can go wireless instead - but then you will need a
wireless
> card for the desktop. Is there a picture of the router that you tell one
way
> or another? Failing that, what's the model number?
>
> > Secondly, just how easy is a wireless network to set up, I read in
Computer
> > Active that it can be tricky,
>
> Not really. In a perfect world: Turn on the router, laptop immediately
> detects the connection, it works, you resist the temptation to leave it
alone
> as it now works for everyone in the street, so you need to do a bit of
> fiddling to ensure only you and your girls can use it - which means enable
WEP
> or WPA encryption, change the default SSID and don't broadcast it. This
is
> not actually that difficult, but it's a lot easier to show than describe.
> You'll probably have to log into the router to do this, and it'll probably
> have a web interface that makes it straightforward.
>
> > (I don't like tricky) can I end up loosing all
> > my settings for the internet
>
> Make sure you know your login name and password, everything else can be
> reinstated....
>
> > How does a router work
>
> You don't want or need to know :-) But it's a lot cleverer than a hub or
a
> switch, which in practice means it's easier to set up as it tells the
machines
> connected to it what they need to know.
>
> > If anyone can help me out they will have the pleasure of knowing they
have
> > saved the relationship between a Father and his Daughters
>
> I'm a sucker for father/daughter relationships. If this doesn't give you
some
> confidence let me know and I'll try and help you through it. I'm not an
> expert (software is my thing), but I have laboured through this a couple
of
> times....
>
> --
>
> F
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004

Just clicked on the link to see if it would work and you guessed it, it
doesn't
Ferger
the front of the box says "Wireless Cable/DSL Gateway Router 54g,virtually
5xFASTER
Can't seem to find a model number, sorry, but hope this helps

Confidence draining

Jim


"Jim" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:c0bm9i$o4q$(E-Mail Removed)...
> Ferger
>
> First of all, apologies for this reply, I am not up to speed with
snipping,
> and I know your not sposed to top post, God I know more than I realised.
> Secondly, thank you for the reply, I can feel the confidence starting to
> surge through my veins, the kids are looking on with eager
> anticipation.....................................w ill sleep on it and give
> it a go tomorrow.
> I have had a good look at the router box and it does not mention a USB
> connection, any way, here is a photo of the router, copyright of those
> wonderfully helpful people at PC World
>
http://www.pcworld.co.uk/martprd/sto...ID=@@@@1802433
>
337.1076448925@@@@&BV_EngineID=cccfadckjhfjffkcflg ceggdhhmdfhl.0&page=Produc
> t&sku=886496&category_oid=-9984&fm=null&sm=null&tm=null
> I was told this was the router I needed when the girls picked there laptop
> All the other info you have supplied is 500% more than our friendly store
> supplied, and probably 10000% more accurate, after looking at the router,
if
> there is any more info you can give me, it will be gratefully accepted.
>
> Many thanks, this could get me some cred back with my two offspring
>
> Cheers
>
> Jim
>
>
> "Ferger" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > In article <c0aj26$7qo$(E-Mail Removed)>, Jim wrote:
> > > I would like to set up a wireless network between my desktop and
laptop
> > > computer but I am a complete beginner when it comes to networking, I
> have
> > > had so much conflicting advice from the likes of PC World and Curry's
> that I
> > > don't know where to start.
> >
> > Forget anything you have been told from these sources, it's almost
> certainly
> > wrong.
> >
> > > I have a Medion desktop running XP with a 10/100 Ethernet socket on
the
> > > back
> >
> > That bit's good....
> >
> > , I have an E Machine laptop with built in WiFi
> >
> > and that bit
> >
> > > and a Belkin wireless Router
> >
> > Where did this come from? Assuming it is the correct router (ie for use
> with
> > a USB modem) then the modem will plug into it directly via a USB port.
If
> it
> > has ports for a wired connection (likely) then you don't need a wireless
> card
> > for the desktop, just connect it directly with some CAT5 cable. If it's
> too
> > far away, then you can go wireless instead - but then you will need a
> wireless
> > card for the desktop. Is there a picture of the router that you tell
one
> way
> > or another? Failing that, what's the model number?
> >
> > > Secondly, just how easy is a wireless network to set up, I read in
> Computer
> > > Active that it can be tricky,
> >
> > Not really. In a perfect world: Turn on the router, laptop immediately
> > detects the connection, it works, you resist the temptation to leave it
> alone
> > as it now works for everyone in the street, so you need to do a bit of
> > fiddling to ensure only you and your girls can use it - which means
enable
> WEP
> > or WPA encryption, change the default SSID and don't broadcast it. This
> is
> > not actually that difficult, but it's a lot easier to show than
describe.
> > You'll probably have to log into the router to do this, and it'll
probably
> > have a web interface that makes it straightforward.
> >
> > > (I don't like tricky) can I end up loosing all
> > > my settings for the internet
> >
> > Make sure you know your login name and password, everything else can be
> > reinstated....
> >
> > > How does a router work
> >
> > You don't want or need to know :-) But it's a lot cleverer than a hub
or
> a
> > switch, which in practice means it's easier to set up as it tells the
> machines
> > connected to it what they need to know.
> >
> > > If anyone can help me out they will have the pleasure of knowing they
> have
> > > saved the relationship between a Father and his Daughters
> >
> > I'm a sucker for father/daughter relationships. If this doesn't give
you
> some
> > confidence let me know and I'll try and help you through it. I'm not an
> > expert (software is my thing), but I have laboured through this a couple
> of
> > times....
> >
> > --
> >
> > F
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004

In article <c0bmoc$l1t$(E-Mail Removed)>, Jim wrote:
> Just clicked on the link to see if it would work and you guessed it, it
> doesn't
> Ferger
> the front of the box says "Wireless Cable/DSL Gateway Router 54g,virtually
> 5xFASTER
> Can't seem to find a model number, sorry, but hope this helps
>
> Confidence draining
>

I've just done a quick scan round and I think this is the wrong device. You
have an ADSL modem that plugs into a USB port, yes? As far as I can see,
this device has no USB port and is designed to share a connection that is
presented over Ethernet ie, a cable broadband connection or a DSL
connection in some countries, but not this one :-(

I would give PC World a ring, tell them you have a USB modem and can't see
how this router could be used and see what they say. I think it's probably
possible to use it, but only after some nasty network fudging via the
desktop. There are plenty of devices designed to work in exactly the way
you need (I have one - a Vigor 2200USB, although it's not wireless, I have a
separate Wireless Access Point connected to it)

Let us know how you get on....

--

F

Ferger

You were right, went into PC World and a lad who seemed to know what he was
talking about said there was no USB connection on that Router

He has got me looking into a BelkinWireless USB Adaptor, he says this is all
I need to get to get both computers to communicate with each other, only
problem is the laptop would not run at top internet speed, I am not really
worried about this, just as long as both girls can access the net at the
same time will do for me.

He did not know how to stop anyone else accessing my computer though, say a
neighbour with a WiFi laptop.

Any thoughts on this gratefully accepted, half term starts tomorrow, kids
have started to pack their bags, not living with a dinosaur any longer, hang
on, this might not be so bad after all

Jim

"Ferger" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> In article <c0bmoc$l1t$(E-Mail Removed)>, Jim wrote:
> > Just clicked on the link to see if it would work and you guessed it, it
> > doesn't
> > Ferger
> > the front of the box says "Wireless Cable/DSL Gateway Router
54g,virtually
> > 5xFASTER
> > Can't seem to find a model number, sorry, but hope this helps
> >
> > Confidence draining
> >
>
> I've just done a quick scan round and I think this is the wrong device.
You
> have an ADSL modem that plugs into a USB port, yes? As far as I can see,
> this device has no USB port and is designed to share a connection that is
> presented over Ethernet ie, a cable broadband connection or a DSL
> connection in some countries, but not this one :-(
>
> I would give PC World a ring, tell them you have a USB modem and can't see
> how this router could be used and see what they say. I think it's
probably
> possible to use it, but only after some nasty network fudging via the
> desktop. There are plenty of devices designed to work in exactly the way
> you need (I have one - a Vigor 2200USB, although it's not wireless, I have
a
> separate Wireless Access Point connected to it)
>
> Let us know how you get on....
>
> --
>
> F
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004

Jim secured a place in history by writing:

> You were right, went into PC World and a lad who seemed to know what he
> was talking about said there was no USB connection on that Router

Thought so. Honestly, PC World numpties shouldn't be allowed to sell this
stuff....
>
> He has got me looking into a BelkinWireless USB Adaptor, he says this
> is all I need to get to get both computers to communicate with each
> other

True (ish). But if he's suggesting what I think he is, the range would be
limited (and whats the point of WAP if you can't use the laptop in the back
garden :-) ) and you would have to set the desktop up as a router in
software using Internet Connection Sharing - which I believe is relatively
easy under XP, but it was a fiddle when I did it a few years ago under
Win98. I never found it particularly robust and had to occasionally reboot
machines because it stopped working. Critically, a solution along these
lines would require the desktop to be on in order to use the internet from
the laptop.

, only problem is the laptop would not run at top internet speed,

I don't know why he would claim this, can't see there is any truth in it.
Sounds like the sort of qualification offered by a PC World numptie to make
it sound like he knows what he is talking about.

> I am not really worried about this, just as long as both girls can
> access the net at the same time will do for me.

What you really want (from an economically sound perspective) is a router
that accepts a USB Modem input (like the one I have) but also has wireless
capability. Googling around, it looks to me like no-one makes one -
Draytek doesn't even make my router anymore, I suspect because routers with
the modem built-in have become so cheap, there is no point in a two-box
solution when you can build it into one. Several companies however make
routers with built in ADSL modems and wireless capability - including
Belkin

http://www.dabs.com/uk/shopbybrand/b...quicklinx=2SFG

and Draytek

http://www.draytek.co.uk/products/vigor2600g.html

These give you everything you want, you sell the old modem on eBay and they
are likely to be the easiest to set up because of their one box nature.

> He did not know how to stop anyone else accessing my computer though,
> say a neighbour with a WiFi laptop.

All 11g products are going to be capable of WEP encryption at least, which
is not particularly difficult to set up and is more than robust enough for
home use, as long as you don't tell your neighbours your passphrase. In
practice, you can change the ID of the network to something unguessable and
stop it from being broadcast, so the hacker with a laptop wouldn't be able
to scan for it's existence or guess what it might be called even if he knew
it was there, which makes it very difficult to use it. And most 11g WAPs
allow you to limit the hardware which can connect to it, so you could
restrict the use to only the girls laptop. In practice, WEP (or the
stronger WPA) enryption, a change of ID and disabling broadcasting is more
than enough.
>
> Any thoughts on this gratefully accepted

See above :-)

> half term starts tomorrow,
> kids have started to pack their bags, not living with a dinosaur any
> longer, hang on, this might not be so bad after all

Ask them for their recommendations on setup. When they fail to come up
with anything of any use, point out that Dad is not an IT expert but an
(insert chosen profession) and is labouring to become an expert solely for
the love of his children. Some of us didn't even have a radio in our
bedroom when we were kids.... :-)

--
F

Thanks for that Ferger, have just had a quick glance through, printing it
off, and will have a good read through, like the tip with the girls.

Here is the latest greatest (according to PC Woeful) and only thing I will
need to get me up and running the way I want, see what you think.
http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatProdu...=&Product_Id=1
22996

All the best

Jim

"Ferger" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns948E6760D7EB5gsx750057xsg@195.129.110.68.. .
> Jim secured a place in history by writing:
>
> > You were right, went into PC World and a lad who seemed to know what he
> > was talking about said there was no USB connection on that Router
>
> Thought so. Honestly, PC World numpties shouldn't be allowed to sell this
> stuff....
> >
> > He has got me looking into a BelkinWireless USB Adaptor, he says this
> > is all I need to get to get both computers to communicate with each
> > other
>
> True (ish). But if he's suggesting what I think he is, the range would be
> limited (and whats the point of WAP if you can't use the laptop in the
back
> garden :-) ) and you would have to set the desktop up as a router in
> software using Internet Connection Sharing - which I believe is relatively
> easy under XP, but it was a fiddle when I did it a few years ago under
> Win98. I never found it particularly robust and had to occasionally
reboot
> machines because it stopped working. Critically, a solution along these
> lines would require the desktop to be on in order to use the internet from
> the laptop.
>
> , only problem is the laptop would not run at top internet speed,
>
> I don't know why he would claim this, can't see there is any truth in it.
> Sounds like the sort of qualification offered by a PC World numptie to
make
> it sound like he knows what he is talking about.
>
> > I am not really worried about this, just as long as both girls can
> > access the net at the same time will do for me.
>
> What you really want (from an economically sound perspective) is a router
> that accepts a USB Modem input (like the one I have) but also has wireless
> capability. Googling around, it looks to me like no-one makes one -
> Draytek doesn't even make my router anymore, I suspect because routers
with
> the modem built-in have become so cheap, there is no point in a two-box
> solution when you can build it into one. Several companies however make
> routers with built in ADSL modems and wireless capability - including
> Belkin
>
> http://www.dabs.com/uk/shopbybrand/b...quicklinx=2SFG
>
> and Draytek
>
> http://www.draytek.co.uk/products/vigor2600g.html
>
> These give you everything you want, you sell the old modem on eBay and
they
> are likely to be the easiest to set up because of their one box nature.
>
> > He did not know how to stop anyone else accessing my computer though,
> > say a neighbour with a WiFi laptop.
>
> All 11g products are going to be capable of WEP encryption at least, which
> is not particularly difficult to set up and is more than robust enough for
> home use, as long as you don't tell your neighbours your passphrase. In
> practice, you can change the ID of the network to something unguessable
and
> stop it from being broadcast, so the hacker with a laptop wouldn't be able
> to scan for it's existence or guess what it might be called even if he
knew
> it was there, which makes it very difficult to use it. And most 11g WAPs
> allow you to limit the hardware which can connect to it, so you could
> restrict the use to only the girls laptop. In practice, WEP (or the
> stronger WPA) enryption, a change of ID and disabling broadcasting is more
> than enough.
> >
> > Any thoughts on this gratefully accepted
>
> See above :-)
>
> > half term starts tomorrow,
> > kids have started to pack their bags, not living with a dinosaur any
> > longer, hang on, this might not be so bad after all
>
> Ask them for their recommendations on setup. When they fail to come up
> with anything of any use, point out that Dad is not an IT expert but an
> (insert chosen profession) and is labouring to become an expert solely for
> the love of his children. Some of us didn't even have a radio in our
> bedroom when we were kids.... :-)
>
> --
> F


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.577 / Virus Database: 366 - Release Date: 03/02/2004