Help Me Convince Someone that WiFi is Wrong for This Applicaton

This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
against Linksys stuff, but not here.)

How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!

Someone that should know better is helping a company set up a LAN in a
highrise office building. Since the CAT5 wire closet is a modest mess
(I've seen much worse) he went an put in a Linksys WiFi AP next to the
ADSL line which is also the office FAX line. He got USB WiFI fobs for
the desktop machines and a couple of network printers. That's 9
machines and with luck, growing. In addition, a Linksys router is used
to tap into the LAN of someone else in the building, with a legit
business relationship.

They've just ordered a Dell server and it's going to run a low-volume
web site accessable from the public internet and since he won't spend
the time to figure out the CAT5 infrastructure he wants to put this
public web server thru a WiFi link to get to the ADSL demarc, where
the AP is.

The thing is everything he's done to date has worked, out of the box
and he's having a ball. It's like building a model train layout. He
hasn't seen it screw up yet.

The place is wired for CAT5, they are too lazy to move some heavy
furnature to get at the jacks. The would also need a hub
in the rack in the closet. big deal.

Thanks for giving me a chance to rant.

FWIW I was able to get him to enable WEP.






--
Al Dykes
-----------
(E-Mail Removed)

On 15 Sep 2003 22:07:48 -0400, (E-Mail Removed) (Al Dykes) wrote:

>This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
>internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
>web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
>against Linksys stuff, but not here.)
>
>How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
>tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
>of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!

Might not care but that setups half duplex. Can send data or receive
but not both at once. Any $5 PCI nic gives a full duplex connection.
------------
When your PC gives a little they give a lot.
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/disco

"Al Dykes" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:bk5r9k$71i$(E-Mail Removed)...
> This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
> internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
> web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
> against Linksys stuff, but not here.)

Everybody wants a lot of things...

> How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
> tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
> of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!

You don't have to convince him. You've done your job by telling him that
it's a very bad idea and that you're not taking any responsibility.

> Someone that should know better is helping a company set up a LAN in a
> highrise office building. Since the CAT5 wire closet is a modest mess
> (I've seen much worse) he went an put in a Linksys WiFi AP next to the
> ADSL line which is also the office FAX line. He got USB WiFI fobs for
> the desktop machines and a couple of network printers. That's 9
> machines and with luck, growing. In addition, a Linksys router is used
> to tap into the LAN of someone else in the building, with a legit
> business relationship.

Whatever.

> They've just ordered a Dell server and it's going to run a low-volume
> web site accessable from the public internet and since he won't spend
> the time to figure out the CAT5 infrastructure he wants to put this
> public web server thru a WiFi link to get to the ADSL demarc, where
> the AP is.

Well... it's an idea as any other.

> The thing is everything he's done to date has worked, out of the box
> and he's having a ball. It's like building a model train layout. He
> hasn't seen it screw up yet.

Maybe he wants something to go wrong? Than he can rebuild his "model train".

> The place is wired for CAT5, they are too lazy to move some heavy
> furnature to get at the jacks. The would also need a hub
> in the rack in the closet. big deal.

Search for a solution that's good and doesn't need excesive furniture moving
and wiring closet adaptations.

Regards,

Thor.

speed, this is a major reason. Wifi is damn slow


"Al Dykes" <(E-Mail Removed)> a écrit dans le message de
news:bk5r9k$71i$(E-Mail Removed)...
> This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
> internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
> web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
> against Linksys stuff, but not here.)
>
> How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
> tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
> of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!
>
> Someone that should know better is helping a company set up a LAN in a
> highrise office building. Since the CAT5 wire closet is a modest mess
> (I've seen much worse) he went an put in a Linksys WiFi AP next to the
> ADSL line which is also the office FAX line. He got USB WiFI fobs for
> the desktop machines and a couple of network printers. That's 9
> machines and with luck, growing. In addition, a Linksys router is used
> to tap into the LAN of someone else in the building, with a legit
> business relationship.
>
> They've just ordered a Dell server and it's going to run a low-volume
> web site accessable from the public internet and since he won't spend
> the time to figure out the CAT5 infrastructure he wants to put this
> public web server thru a WiFi link to get to the ADSL demarc, where
> the AP is.
>
> The thing is everything he's done to date has worked, out of the box
> and he's having a ball. It's like building a model train layout. He
> hasn't seen it screw up yet.
>
> The place is wired for CAT5, they are too lazy to move some heavy
> furnature to get at the jacks. The would also need a hub
> in the rack in the closet. big deal.
>
> Thanks for giving me a chance to rant.
>
> FWIW I was able to get him to enable WEP.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Al Dykes
> -----------
> (E-Mail Removed)
>

Hi Al,

At least the customer's not running the server on a laptop that he
moves around the building all day long! After 17 years in the
networking industry, I've learned that some customers will do whatever
they want, no matter what the advice. So just wait and be prepared, if
necessary, to switch over to an Ethernet connection. Serving a
revenue-producing web site on DSL is also iffy, depending on the type
of DSL service this customer has. Perhaps if he is wildly successful,
you can get him a higher-speed Internet link and an Ethernet card in
the server at the same time!

Craig Wiesner - A Newbie's Guide to Wireless Networks
http://www.wkmn.com/newsite/newbie.html

(E-Mail Removed) (Al Dykes) wrote in message news:<bk5r9k$71i$(E-Mail Removed)>...
> This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
> internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
> web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
> against Linksys stuff, but not here.)
>
> How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
> tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
> of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!
>
> Someone that should know better is helping a company set up a LAN in a
> highrise office building. Since the CAT5 wire closet is a modest mess
> (I've seen much worse) he went an put in a Linksys WiFi AP next to the
> ADSL line which is also the office FAX line. He got USB WiFI fobs for
> the desktop machines and a couple of network printers. That's 9
> machines and with luck, growing. In addition, a Linksys router is used
> to tap into the LAN of someone else in the building, with a legit
> business relationship.
>
> They've just ordered a Dell server and it's going to run a low-volume
> web site accessable from the public internet and since he won't spend
> the time to figure out the CAT5 infrastructure he wants to put this
> public web server thru a WiFi link to get to the ADSL demarc, where
> the AP is.
>
> The thing is everything he's done to date has worked, out of the box
> and he's having a ball. It's like building a model train layout. He
> hasn't seen it screw up yet.
>
> The place is wired for CAT5, they are too lazy to move some heavy
> furnature to get at the jacks. The would also need a hub
> in the rack in the closet. big deal.
>
> Thanks for giving me a chance to rant.
>
> FWIW I was able to get him to enable WEP.

>> This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
against Linksys stuff, but not here.)

How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!

Al:

Let him know of the potential liability for exposing customer info.

I had a boat dealer ask me about doing very high dollar electronic bank
transfers from a computer with Quicken that was also used for other purposes
including the Internet in general.
He did not like my opinion.

And LinkSys? You should just move on.

Linksys is bad ?


"CZ" <(E-Mail Removed)> a écrit dans le message de
news:rpQ9b.852$(E-Mail Removed).. .
> >> This is the WiFi network from hell. The customer wants to run a the
> internet connection serving his revenue producing, business critical,
> web server over a Wifi link using Linksys equipment. (I have nothing
> against Linksys stuff, but not here.)
>
> How do I convince someone that this is a Very Bad Idea ? All I can
> tell him right now is that the wrong cordless phone could put him out
> of business. This doesn't impress him. HELP!!
>
> Al:
>
> Let him know of the potential liability for exposing customer info.
>
> I had a boat dealer ask me about doing very high dollar electronic bank
> transfers from a computer with Quicken that was also used for other
purposes
> including the Internet in general.
> He did not like my opinion.
>
> And LinkSys? You should just move on.
>
>

In message <v56ab.89700$(E-Mail Removed)>, Dave Weller
<(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>Linksys is bad ?

I'd tend not to condemn a particular manufacturer. Perhaps a particular
model. If any of the "main player" manufacturers was at all bad then
they would be unlikely to still be in business - and they certainly
would not be a "main player".

We have to remember that all these network boxes/cards are mass-produced
items, often made at some remote Taiwan or Korean factory. If they are
checked coming off the production line its very unlikely to be more than
a token "go/no-go" test. If you get a box/card which you're unhappy
about then its rarely difficult to get it swapped out with the same
model - especially as your supplier is usually nothing more than a
box-shifter, hasn't the time to test returned items, and will likely
re-package a (possibly defective) item and sell it on in the normal
course of things. Of course these box-shifters will give you assurances
that they test every item - but then they're bound to do so aren't they.
Its a simple case of economics - the retail price of many items is not
much more than the cost of an hour's support/test labour - so why should
they?

It's many, many years ago that I worked for a company who
designed/manufactured transceivers in the very early days of the
Internet and none were even connected before being shipped - If we had a
return rate less than one in ten then it was a very good month :-)

I don't think that things have changed much in the intervening years,
just that the failure-rate is lower due to better manufacturing methods.
--
Tony Morgan
Smile in the face of adversity - and adversity will probably
think you're taking the piss and kick the shit out of you.

> Linksys is bad ?

Dave:

Not necessarily bad, but it is not hard to buy better.

IMO, many people who buy LinkSys are very price conscious buyers, and are
not aware of (or interested in) some trade-offs.
For example, calling NAT a firewall is somewhat misleading, and SPI in
LinkSys routers has been an issue, and firmware stability has been an issue
for some.

When I decided to buy a wired router I noticed that many users with problem
LinkSys routers were switching to Netgear. So, I bought a Netgear, and I
was so impressed that I bought a 2nd unit of the same model. The Netgear
router has very strong packet filtering firewall rules for inbound and
outbound control on each router interface (and it was not advertised as
being SPI). The Netgear supports SysLog and logs TCP/UDP and ICMP hits.
Solid value, no BS.
When I decided to buy wireless, I noticed similar complaints about LinkSys
products, and praise for Orinoco. So, I bought an RG100, then two BG2000,
which have never been a problem. Solid value, no BS.

One Netgear router has been up 24x7 for about 3 years w/o problems.
One BG2000 has been up 24x7 for about 18 mo w/o problems.

In message <fK7ab.970$(E-Mail Removed)>, CZ
<(E-Mail Removed)> writes

I have little experience of the various manufacturers kit, but I'm very
pleased with my DG824M. However, the log format is dreadful - the fields
are laid in willie-nilly. Haven't these guys heard of comma separated
fields? For anyone trying to do any sort of log analysis with Access or
Excel it's a nightmare. Such a minor detail which spoils a nice product.

I have, BTW, also a Linksys WUSB11 WA, and while I realise it doesn't
need a lot of functionality for me its good, very easy to install and
configure and (for me most importantly) has a very good range.

--
Tony Morgan
Smile in the face of adversity - and adversity will probably
think you're taking the piss and kick the shit out of you.