Help with HotSpot Setup

I spent most of today reading old messages from this group and browsing the
web on this topic. However, I never really could find all I needed.

I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but not
open. Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant them
access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get on
for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
"freeloading."

So, what is the best was to do this. I know I need...

1. Cable/DSL (commercial account)
2. Router
3. Access Point (maybe integrated into #2)

Now, what I don't understand is how to control access. It seems like this
would be some sort of hardware/software combination or just software maybe
using a specialized proxy server?

I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I have
seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
getting good information seems to be hard to come by.

Thanks for any help,

Phillip

> I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I have
> seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
> getting good information seems to be hard to come by.

I have one of those that I'm playing with, what do you want to know?

David.

"Phillip T. Murphy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:rJ58b.293$(E-Mail Removed)...
> I spent most of today reading old messages from this group and browsing
the
> web on this topic. However, I never really could find all I needed.
>
> I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but
not
> open. Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant
them
> access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get
on
> for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
> "freeloading."
>
> So, what is the best was to do this. I know I need...
>
> 1. Cable/DSL (commercial account)
> 2. Router
> 3. Access Point (maybe integrated into #2)
>
> Now, what I don't understand is how to control access. It seems like this
> would be some sort of hardware/software combination or just software maybe
> using a specialized proxy server?
>
> I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I have
> seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
> getting good information seems to be hard to come by.
>
> Thanks for any help,
>
> Phillip
>
>

Without getting more sophisticated validation equipment, you could just
encrypt the wireless signal and change the key daily.

If you enable WEP then you can make people have a password to get in.
Not "strictly" a password but a string of numbers/letters/whatever.
NOTHING is unbreakable, some one given enough time WILL break in if
they think there is something worthwhile inside!

On Thu, 11 Sep 2003 16:24:09 -0500, "Phillip T. Murphy"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I spent most of today reading old messages from this group and browsing the
>web on this topic. However, I never really could find all I needed.
>
>I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but not
>open. Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant them
>access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get on
>for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
>"freeloading."
>
>So, what is the best was to do this. I know I need...
>
>1. Cable/DSL (commercial account)
>2. Router
>3. Access Point (maybe integrated into #2)
>
>Now, what I don't understand is how to control access. It seems like this
>would be some sort of hardware/software combination or just software maybe
>using a specialized proxy server?
>
>I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I have
>seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
>getting good information seems to be hard to come by.
>
>Thanks for any help,
>
>Phillip
>

-- Have you checked your Smoke Detector...LATELY?

"David Taylor" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I
have
> > seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
> > getting good information seems to be hard to come by.
>
> I have one of those that I'm playing with, what do you want to know?
>
> David.

David,

Really just curious how it works, how flexible it is in setting up rates to
bill - by the hour, day, monthly, etc. Also, can you "give" access away?
For instance, I set a level of purchases required and the user gets a
certain amount of time free.

How difficult to setup?
Is it reliable?
Where to get in the US?
How Much?

Thanks for any help you can give me.

Phillip

> Really just curious how it works, how flexible it is in setting up rates to
> bill - by the hour, day, monthly, etc. Also, can you "give" access away?
> For instance, I set a level of purchases required and the user gets a
> certain amount of time free.

Right, well, it's an AP with detachable antenna's (RP-SMA) which is a
good thing if you want to experiment and has it's own built in
functionality. The web configuration is extremely comprehensive and
provides plenty of versatility. We haven't yet established precisely
what we want from this one yet because I'm just suggesting things to my
boss to see what she likes.

As an example, you can run it with no login requirement whatsoever or
with a login requirement. To configure the login page, it can either do
a default one, one with frames, or one where you just fill in a URL to
the device. Here's the one which we knocked up in a few minutes as a
concept test:-

http://www.equationonline.co.uk/accesspoint

That's the actual login page, BTW, not just one that I placed somewhere
for you and all the config requires is that URL so you can do whatever
you want on that page.

You can offer walled garden support either by tweaking your login page
or by entering a list of URL's that can be surfed from the login page
with no authentication.

Alternatively, you might prefer to allow free access with no
authentication but pop up a banner add from time to time. Here's the
banner add that we threw together in a hurry:-

http://www.equationonline.co.uk/accesspoint/intro.htm

You can provide 4 basic rates, entirely up to you how much, how long and
what currency unit to display. You can go to the units accounting page
to select one of the four rates which could be as follows for example:-

Rate 1 = 1 hour
Rate 2 = 1 day
Rate 3 = 3 days
Rate 4 = 1 week

All the vendor does is press a button on the rate page and then it can
print out to a local printer, all the details required to log in.

An alternative is the little receipt type printer which is actually very
neat and that works in that you set up your four rates as above and then
if you press the button on the printer, it prints a ticket and would
give you 1 hour credit. If someone wanted 3 hours then that's easy, you
just press the button 3 times quickly and it prints a 3 hour ticket.

The ticket contains customisable info about your accesspoint, a welcome
message, SSID, WEP key, rate, login time (accounts can be set to expire
if unused etc.)

As to your question about free access, absolutely, you could say set
rate 1 to be an hour but rate 4 to be a whole day with no charge. On
the other hand rate 1 could be 1 hour for $15 but if you don't actually
ask for money, the actual printed value is irrelevant if you give them
the credentials!

The web config allows you to examine accounts that have been created,
you can delete them, terminate the session, it will save a log of
session activity, report it back to head office via syslog
functionality, you can configure SSL for authentication security and so
on.

> How difficult to setup?

I presume you can fall off a log? It's *very* easy to get up and
running. If you have configured a basic accesspoint before then you can
get it functional in 15 minutes but you'll want to play for hours just
to see what things can do. The only mistake I made was that I hadn't
engaged brain because on the back are 5 ethernet ports, 4 are basically
a built in switch and one is for the WAN port. Numpty here connected
the unit to the network via one of the LAN ports (reasonable) and of
course it wasn't forwarding anything because it NAT's to the WAN port!


> Is it reliable?

Well I haven't run it in anger but I have no reason to suspect not, it
does have a self monitoring feature which claims to reboot itself if
there's a problem.

> Where to get in the US?

I posted a link a couple of weeks ago, do a Google search for Pheenet
WAS-001 or WAS-002 I think it was but it's on their site anyway and with
a downloadable manual which shows the config screens.

> How Much?

UK, I think it was 400 quid or thereabouts so in the US between 400 to
600 dollars I'd guess. Not at all unreasonable.

It would suit a hotel where someone was happy to go to reception, or a
coffee shop or similar. The only snag is that as far as I can see,
there's no feasible way to couple it to a payment gateway such that it
could take a credit card payment. Hence a visitor network where the
client just makes a CC payment and gets instant access won't work
*unless* on the login screen it says "phone reception" or similar and
they take manual payment.

David.

> Thanks for any help you can give me.
>
> Phillip
>
>
>

Phillip T. Murphy <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but not
>open. Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant them
>access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get on
>for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
>"freeloading."

Two scenarios.
1) Free guest access but authenticated and secure
2) Buy a sandwich, get some free time.

We've been talking about this stuff for years now and I've still yet to
see a proper solution. So here's a challenge to all the experts,
analysts and commentators to actually come up with a step by step setup
for these.

If you've got the money, the second one is probably fairly straight
forwards as people like Toshiba sell an all-in-one box to do it.

The first one is more interesting because it's really about private
individuals who want to share their broadband access[1] with the street
but *really* need to make their own use secure and to make the guest
access secure and limited. This is further complicated by current and
proposed legislation about logs and data protection.

The only solutions I know of right now involve a PC running Linux
controlling the show. This is not a consumer grade solution!

[1]Before we go off on a tangent, let's just assume that the upstream
ISP does actually allow this.
--
Julian Bond Email&MSM: (E-Mail Removed)
Webmaster: http://www.ecademy.com/
Personal WebLog: http://www.voidstar.com/
M: +44 (0)77 5907 2173 T: +44 (0)192 0412 433

"David Taylor" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> > Really just curious how it works, how flexible it is in setting up rates
to
> > bill - by the hour, day, monthly, etc. Also, can you "give" access
away?
> > For instance, I set a level of purchases required and the user gets a
> > certain amount of time free.
>
> Right, well, it's an AP with detachable antenna's (RP-SMA) which is a
> good thing if you want to experiment and has it's own built in
> functionality. The web configuration is extremely comprehensive and
> provides plenty of versatility. We haven't yet established precisely
> what we want from this one yet because I'm just suggesting things to my
> boss to see what she likes.

WOW! Thanks for the detailed reply. I really appreciate it. Sounds like a
pretty handy little device for a reasonable amount of money.

Phillip

There are several products out there covering Your needs I think.

Here's a few:
http://www.proxim.com/products/all/o...500/index.html

http://www.nomadix.com/products/ag.asp

http://www.zyxel.com/product/model.p...dexFlagvalue=1
021876859


/Hans


"Phillip T. Murphy" <(E-Mail Removed)> skrev i melding
news:rJ58b.293$(E-Mail Removed)...
> I spent most of today reading old messages from this group and browsing
the
> web on this topic. However, I never really could find all I needed.
>
> I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but
not
> open. Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant
them
> access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get
on
> for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
> "freeloading."
>
> So, what is the best was to do this. I know I need...
>
> 1. Cable/DSL (commercial account)
> 2. Router
> 3. Access Point (maybe integrated into #2)
>
> Now, what I don't understand is how to control access. It seems like this
> would be some sort of hardware/software combination or just software maybe
> using a specialized proxy server?
>
> I just don't know where to start looking for a complete solution. I have
> seen the one UK company that has the AP/printer all-in-one gizmo, but
> getting good information seems to be hard to come by.
>
> Thanks for any help,
>
> Phillip
>
>

"Phillip T. Murphy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:rJ58b.293$(E-Mail Removed)...
> I would like to setup a hotspot in our store. I want it to be fee, but
not
> open.

You might consider "open" and "free or paid".

> Basically, if someone comes in and buys something, I could grant them
> access as needed. I don't want to leave it open so just anyone could get
on
> for free by either camping outside a window or just coming in an
> "freeloading."

Understandable.

> So, what is the best was to do this. I know I need...
> 1. Cable/DSL (commercial account)

+ modem

> 2. Router
> 3. Access Point (maybe integrated into #2)

Depends on what you want to accomplish.

> Now, what I don't understand is how to control access. It seems like this
> would be some sort of hardware/software combination or just software maybe
> using a specialized proxy server?

1) Basic approach: deny all except the MAC addresses you specify. This means
that you ask the person's MAC address and add it to the list of allowed MAC
addresses in the Access Point. Most if not all Access Points have this
functionality.

2) You hookup with a WISP, who can provide you a full service from
installation & configuration, to customized portal pages, free website
access, authentication and billing, etc... In this scenario you have to
discuss the details with the WISP (who pays what), most likely they will
allow you to give away free access.

3) You setup a computer with 2 NICs and the necessary software to do what
the WISP would do. Of course you can have someone do it for you.

Scenario 1 is the easiest at first, but as people start using it more and
more it becomes unmanageable.
Scenario 2 and 3 differ in that you provide the service on your own or you
have a WISP providing the service. Both have advantages and disadvantages.
Have a look at what a WISP can offer (portal pages, free services, PDA
support, linking to Mobile Phone operators, linking to ISPs, roaming with
other WISPs, etc...)

Regards,

Thor.