DSL vs Server

I'll try to make this short, but still detailed.

I have a small office. 5 PC network through an HP Procurve switch to a
Windows 2000 server. The server hands out the IP addresses.

Originally set up Ameritech DSL. Of course the Efficient 5861 DSL
modem/router also wanted to pass out IP addresses. It was easy enough to get
tweak it and us NAT to make all the equipment happy. Every system in the
office could both go online and see the server and the rest of the network.

Now, AT&T Yahoo took over. Without bothering to mention it to anyone, the
first thing they did was to get rid of our DSL line and move our DSL over to
our fax line (I have about a dozen phone lines coming into the office). Of
course, we figured it out when we couldn't get online or send/receive
emails.

Moving along, here's where I'm at now and my problem.

The 5861 died right about the time all this was happening. It got replaced
with an "AT&T Yahoo! Speedstream 4100".

Now I'm back to the 4100 and the server both wanting to assign IP addresses.
The 4100 is nowhere near as tweakable, so I'm rather lost on how to deal
with this. I can make it so you can get online OR connect with the server,
but not both.

I'm thinking I can just put a router between the Procurve and the 4100 and
solve this. Is that correct? If so, any ideas on exactly how I'd want to set
that up (settings)?

Thanks
JP

John P. wrote:
> Moving along, here's where I'm at now and my problem.
>
> The 5861 died right about the time all this was happening. It got replaced
> with an "AT&T Yahoo! Speedstream 4100".
>
> Now I'm back to the 4100 and the server both wanting to assign IP addresses.
> The 4100 is nowhere near as tweakable, so I'm rather lost on how to deal
> with this. I can make it so you can get online OR connect with the server,
> but not both.

Hi John,

I imagine the reason you cant access both services (the internet and the
server) now is because the Server and the Yahoo Speedstream 4100 are
handing out (and handling) IP address's on different 'netmasks'.

Just incase you dont know what a netmask is, when you get given an ip
address from a server/router, you'll typically be given:

1) the IP address (for example: 192.168.1.2)
2) the NETMASK (for example: 255.255.255.0)
3) the Gateway (for example: 192.168.1.1)

The Server and Speedstream 4100 are probably handing out different IP
address schemes and netmasks. I.e. the server might give you:

IP address = 10.1.1.2
Netmask = 255.255.0.0
Gateway = 10.1.1.1

And the SpeedStream might give you

IP Address = 192.168.1.2
Netmask = 255.255.255.0
Gateway = 192.168.1.1

If you are familiar with the DOS prompt, turn off the SpeedStream
router, boot up one of your PC's, go to the command line (START MENU,
RUN, enter "cmd", press <Return>) and type:

ipconfig

Press return, and it'll tell you what its IP Address, Netmask and
Gateway are. Make a note of it.

This should be an ip address given to you by the server (as the router
is turned off).

Shut down the server, turn on the router (give it a few minutes to get
its bearings) and then turn your computer back on. Go to the Command
Line again (as above) and enter "ipconfig", take a note of the IP
address you've been given.

If its exactly the same as before, still in the command line, type:

ipconfig/renew

This should force it to ditch that IP address and ask for a new one from
whatever might be providing IP address's at that time.

Once that is done, return wit hthe results and we'll go about trying to
fix it from there.

Cya!

> I'm thinking I can just put a router between the Procurve and the 4100 and
> solve this. Is that correct? If so, any ideas on exactly how I'd want to set
> that up (settings)?

This is possible, but its over complicated and would mean you'd have to
configure the router, when all that should be necessary is either to get
to the router to conform to the IP address scheme of the Server, or -
probably easier - get the server to conform to the IP address scheme of
the Router.

Unless you know of a reason why the server's IP address cant be changed?

Cya!

"CaptCrazy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in a message

> I imagine the reason you cant access both services (the internet and the
> server) now is because the Server and the Yahoo Speedstream 4100 are
> handing out (and handling) IP address's on different 'netmasks'.

That sounds logical... I'm an OK geek when it comes to PC's, but I don't
know much about networking. ANything I manage to make work is more a matter
of hit or miss. :-)

> The Server and Speedstream 4100 are probably handing out different IP
> address schemes and netmasks. I.e. the server might give you:

OK... I'm with you so far. I was digging around in that area, but I wasn't
sure if I wanted them to be the same or different.


> If you are familiar with the DOS prompt, turn off the SpeedStream router,
> boot up one of your PC's, go to the command line (START MENU, RUN, enter
> "cmd", press <Return>) and type:
> ipconfig
> Once that is done, return wit hthe results and we'll go about trying to
> fix it from there.

I couldn't make it out there tonight... I can tell you what I know for now -
it may be enough to get things rolling

I know the server IP pool is 192.168.0.1 - 192.168.0.255
The systems I was working from last night is 192.168.0.5 and 192.168.0.7
If I'm remembering correctly, I think the subnet mask from the server is
255.255.255.0
In the settings on each system, no gateway is specified (although I used to
have one in there for the old DSL modem/router)

As they are, the systems all communicate with the server fine, as long as I
don't throw the 4100 into the mix.

I left the 4100 at default. Here's what's listed when I go into the config
Default gateway 192.168.0.1
Gateway/Router address 192.168.1.1
DHCP Subnet Mask 255.255.0.0
Startup IP address 192.168.1.64
Ending IP address 192.168.1.64 (yes, they are the same)
WAN IP address 76.197.246.245 (which would change because it's dynamic)
Subnet mask 255.255.255.255
Default gateway 76.197.255.254

>> I'm thinking I can just put a router between the Procurve and the 4100
>> and solve this. Is that correct? If so, any ideas on exactly how I'd want
>> to set that up (settings)?

> This is possible, but its over complicated and would mean you'd have to
> configure the router, when all that should be necessary is either to get
> to the router to conform to the IP address scheme of the Server, or -
> probably easier - get the server to conform to the IP address scheme of
> the Router.

That's what I was thinking as the 4100 doesn't seem to allow for much
tweaking. The setttings in the config are very limited.

> Unless you know of a reason why the server's IP address cant be changed?

I don't, but that doesn't mean anything. It's an insurance brokerage and
they run proprietary software specific to the insurance industry (it's awful
stuff). My sis (she owns the business), in her infinite wisdom, decided we
don't need tech support, so I've been on my own trying to keep this thing
going for the past 5 years (They sold her and set up the entire package -
hardware & software).

So... it's possible that somehow Applied somehow needs the addresses to be
in the current range, but, I really don't think so.

Thanks in advance Crazy. I worked on everything for about 18 hours yesterday
(not just the DSL thing... numerous other issues, including a couple which
required a reinstall of the OS - Win 98... geez, talking about digging
through the pile for an install CD)... I was pretty frustrated and tired
when I left.

"CaptCrazy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in a message

> I imagine the reason you cant access both services (the internet and the
> server) now is because the Server and the Yahoo Speedstream 4100 are
> handing out (and handling) IP address's on different 'netmasks'.

> Once that is done, return wit hthe results and we'll go about trying to
> fix it from there.

All right Crazy... I finally got over there (it's about an hour away) and
came up with the actual info for you.

If I'm hooked into the server, I get...

IP Address 192.168.0.10
Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0
Gateway 192.168.0.254
DHCP Server 192.168.0.5

If I'm hooked into the DSL box, I get...

IP Address 76.197.246.245
Subnet Mask 255.255.255.255
Gateway 76.197.246.244
DHCP Server 192.168.0.5

"John P." <(E-Mail Removed) > prattled
ceaselessly in news:(E-Mail Removed):

> "CaptCrazy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in a message
>
>> I imagine the reason you cant access both services (the internet and
>> the server) now is because the Server and the Yahoo Speedstream 4100
>> are handing out (and handling) IP address's on different 'netmasks'.
>
>> Once that is done, return wit hthe results and we'll go about trying
>> to fix it from there.
>
> All right Crazy... I finally got over there (it's about an hour away)
> and came up with the actual info for you.
>
> If I'm hooked into the server, I get...
>
> IP Address 192.168.0.10
> Subnet Mask 255.255.255.0
> Gateway 192.168.0.254
> DHCP Server 192.168.0.5
>
> If I'm hooked into the DSL box, I get...
>
> IP Address 76.197.246.245
> Subnet Mask 255.255.255.255
> Gateway 76.197.246.244
> DHCP Server 192.168.0.5
>
>
>

The top IP is a private address and the next is a public address. You
need a NAT router for your private address space (your five computers).
Your ISP is probably giving you one public address and that's what your
modem is handing out. This doesn't look like a modem/router combo so
you'll need a router.

--
Catwalker
MCNGP #43
www.mcngp.com
"Definitely not wearing any underwear."

"catwalker63" <_catwalker63_@hotmamamail.com> wrote in a message

> The top IP is a private address and the next is a public address. You
> need a NAT router for your private address space (your five computers).
> Your ISP is probably giving you one public address and that's what your
> modem is handing out. This doesn't look like a modem/router combo so
> you'll need a router.

Yeah... the 4100 has no router. That's how I had everything working before -
DSL/router combo box. I have a few routers laying around, so I'll throw one
in the mix, I was just wondering if there was come way I could get by
without it. I guess not.

Thanks!