Coax Connectors

I am looking for recommendations for where to get good deals on
connectors. Other than Times Microwave and Amphonol, I'm not sure what
brands are high quality and will give the best performance when you are
trying to get the most range out of your link. Hyperlink Technologies
seem to have good prices but, I'm not sure if the Altelicon brand they
sell are any good.

--
Chris W
KE5GIX

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When buying coax fittings you get what you pay for. Cheap price
sometime equats to cheap construction.

I've used times connectors (EZcrimp & soldered) and times coax (LMR
etc) for about 10 years without any problems.

You can shop the connectors and coax all over the place, just remember
that the times EZ-crimp with take about $70.00 in tools to install the
connectors.

the connectors you saw at hyperlink tech are similar to the RF parts
connectors. The center pin connector is crimped on the coax then the
connector is assembled. I've seen people assemble this connector and
because the center conductor of the coax had a little bend they ended
up with a center pin off center when the connector was assembled.
You won't have this problem with the Times EZcrimp version.
the most common LMR you get into with wireless is LMR-400. These
connectors are real easy to install. The rest take a little knowledge
and alot of care. For the small coax I usually by the adapter coaxs
ready made.

below are links to pdf's and a video about the install procedure.


below is a like to the pds's for installing times connectors
http://www.timesmicrowave.com/connectors/drawings.shtml


here's a video of the same thing -
http://www.timesmicrowave.com/connectors/videos.shtml




hope this helps. Make the big ones, buy the small ones and
spend time making it work instead of beating your head against the
wall trying to manufacture the small adapter coax.

Bob Smith
Robert Smith Consutling
Wireless - ISP's - Government - Business

NA6T
life Member ARRL



On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 20:06:08 -0600, Chris W <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I am looking for recommendations for where to get good deals on
>connectors. Other than Times Microwave and Amphonol, I'm not sure what
>brands are high quality and will give the best performance when you are
>trying to get the most range out of your link. Hyperlink Technologies
>seem to have good prices but, I'm not sure if the Altelicon brand they
>sell are any good.

On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 20:06:08 -0600, Chris W <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I am looking for recommendations for where to get good deals on
>connectors. Other than Times Microwave and Amphonol, I'm not sure what
>brands are high quality and will give the best performance when you are
>trying to get the most range out of your link. Hyperlink Technologies
>seem to have good prices but, I'm not sure if the Altelicon brand they
>sell are any good.

One of the demonstrations I like to give at radio club meetings is to
take all the coax cable adapters in my collection, place them in
series, install a watt-guesser at each end of the string, and connect
it all to a transmitter and dummy load. I then ask the audience to
guess how much loss 6ft of connectors is going to show on the
wattmeters. Also, the VSWR. I usually do this at 440Mhz, but have
also done it at 1.2Ghz. Unfortunately, I haven't done this test at
2.4GHz. According to the orthodox advice, adapters and connectors are
lossy. Wanna guess the loss through about 100 random coax adapters?

The answer is about the same as an equivalent length of RG-8/u coax
UHF or phono adapters). I don't worry much about connectors. It's
the coax cable that eats the power.

However, there's one thing that is missing in the above demonstration.
There's no consideration for the quality of the coax connector to coax
cable connection or crimp. This is where literally every single
connector failure I've seen occurs. Manually assembled, non-crimp
type connectors such as the common UG-21 N-connector are an invitation
to eventual failure. Wiggle it enough, and the braid just seperates
inside the connector resulting in a crappy connection. All my test
and production cables are crimped. So are all commercial patch cables
and pigtails. This is especially important in the smaller connectors
(smaller than SMA) where there's very little braid or foil to clamp in
the connector.

Another quality consideration is VSWR. Let's pretend I screw up and
use a 75 ohm cable and connectors instead of 50 ohms. That's not the
same as using a "low quality" connector, but is a fair simulation of
the results. The loss is actually LESS for a 75 ohm system than with
an equivalent length 50 ohm system, because the RF loss per foot at
2.4GHz for 75ohm coax is less.
http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/wireless/75_ohm_hardline.html
The mismatch loss for the 50 to 75 ohm transition (VSWR=1.5:1) is only
0.18dB. Translation: Don't worry about the alleged impedance "bump"
created by a "low quality" connector.

So, what consistitutes a useable "good" connector? Methinks (in
order):
1. Power handling capeability.
2. Corrosion and environmental resistance. Waterproof.
3. No dissimilar metals. Electrolysis prevention.
4. Crimping ability and quality.
5. Mechanical strength.
6. Decent electrical characteristics.

Details:
1. Power handling capeability.
We can ignore this at 2.4GHz unless your running high power with high
RF voltages.

2. Corrosion and environmental resistance. Waterproof.
3. No dissimilar metals. Electrolysis prevention.

These are the real killers. I've cleaned up a few products that were
a mixture of gold, silver, solder plate, zinc, and tin plated
connectors. Add water, salt, and a little DC and you'll shortly find
either corrosion or watch the plateing disappear. In extreme cases,
the mess forms a diode or battery causing RF problems. Whatever you
do, avoid incompatible materials.

4. Crimping ability and quality.
5. Mechanical strength.

That means the crimp joint is both mechanically and electrically
stable. It should be able to pass the pull, twist, and bend test
without falling apart. It should also be cosmetically reasonable. The
current trend is for the connectors to be minimalist and just
extensions of the coax cable. This makes sense, but also tends to
create flimsy connectors, especially the stamped connectors.

6. Decent electrical characteristics.

VSWR and loss. At 2.4GHz, this mostly consists of making sure that
there are no resonances introduced by the connector. The frequency
versus VSWR plots usually reveal any such problems.

So, who are the quality vendors? Well, that varies depending on what
you're trying to build. The list is huge because literally, there are
no "bad" vendors. AMP, Hirose, RF Industries, Amphenol, all make good
connectors. If you're doing CATV (75ohms), the vendor list expands
greatly. What is a problem is bad selection of connectors. SMA
connectors from multiple vendors are all standardized and almost
identical. Concentrate on the connector to coax connection (crimp)
and the rest will take care of itself. For example, the common CAT5
"hex" crimp connectors are really marginal, while the same F-connector
with a "push on" connector is both waterproof and mechanically
superior.

Try Electrocomm and download their latest catalog:
http://www.ecommwireless.com/catalogs.html
for cables and connectors. If you're building your own cables, plan
on spending some money on crimp tools. I probably have about $500
worth of coax crimp tools. The factory crimpers are expensive, but
the clones are now affordable:
http://www.fab-corp.com (under hand tools)
http://customer.manufacture.com.tw/~huau/p8.htm
(HT-301x series of crimpers)


--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Bob Smith wrote:

>When buying coax fittings you get what you pay for. Cheap price
>sometime equats to cheap construction.
>
>I've used times connectors (EZcrimp & soldered) and times coax (LMR
>etc) for about 10 years without any problems.
>
>You can shop the connectors and coax all over the place, just remember
>that the times EZ-crimp with take about $70.00 in tools to install the
>connectors.
>
>

So where do I get the best deal on them? I am having a hard time even
finding the Times Connectors anywhere.

--
Chris W
KE5GIX

Gift Giving Made Easy
Get the gifts you want &
give the gifts they want
One stop wish list for any gift,
from anywhere, for any occasion!
http://thewishzone.com

On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 22:17:10 -0800, Bob Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I've used times connectors (EZcrimp & soldered) and times coax (LMR
>etc) for about 10 years without any problems.

What do you use for stripping the LMR-400? I have a small collection
of plastic strippers, all with dull razor blades. The typical
stripper will last for about 20 connectors. Replacement blades are
advertised but always out of stock. The CATV strippers that I often
use won't adjust to the LMR-400 diameters. I currently use a pocket
knife and diagonal cutters, but that's too much work. I've considered
making my own but that's rediculous.

>I've seen people assemble this connector and
>because the center conductor of the coax had a little bend they ended
>up with a center pin off center when the connector was assembled.

Not me. I have a different way to do it wrong. I crimp the
connectors, at each end, while the LMR-400 is tightly coiled. When I
straighten the coax, the center pins protrude excessively.

Another great mistake is to believe the data sheet and assume that all
types of LMR-400 are exactly 0.405" in diameter. I have some rubber
jacket ultra-flex LMR-400 that is actually 0.415" in diameter and will
just barely fit into the crimp ring sleeve for the RF Industries
connectors.

>You won't have this problem with the Times EZcrimp version.

Agreed. They are great connectors. However, EZ-Crimp connectors are
expensive at $13/ea versus about $3/ea (N-male to LMR-400) for the
more common crimp connectors. See:
http://www.fab-corp.com
which carries both types.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Chris W wrote:

> So where do I get the best deal on them? I am having a hard time even
> finding the Times Connectors anywhere.

Assuming you want LMR400 and N-male, I've had good luck with a bunch of
N connectors I bought for a deal off eBay. Search for "LMR400 connector"
and there's some for sale now. Belden brand, I'm not sure that's the
same product that I bought but looks similar. The ones I got came with
nice heatshrink that comes way up on the connector and down on the
cable, nice way to waterproof that part of it. I got the crimper from
www.electro-comm.com

You can get top quality coax for 2.4Ghz and above from here.

http://www.diodecomms.co.uk/

He posts to anywhere in the world, take a look at the Ecoflex range.

Note the EcoFlex-10 N type connectors fit LMR400

--
JM

On Sat, 24 Dec 2005, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.internet.wireless, in article
<(E-Mail Removed)>, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

Holiday Greetings!

>What do you use for stripping the LMR-400? I have a small collection
>of plastic strippers, all with dull razor blades. The typical
>stripper will last for about 20 connectors. Replacement blades are
>advertised but always out of stock.

You mean something like the old Ideal 45-51x series? We used to buy
the replacement blades direct, and in fairly large quantities. That
would last for a while, but they aren't perishable.

>The CATV strippers that I often use won't adjust to the LMR-400
>diameters. I currently use a pocket knife and diagonal cutters, but
>that's too much work. I've considered making my own but that's
>rediculous.

Klein Tools used to make a relatively nice one - I managed to loose the
last one I had about five years ago. Last time I looked at their catalog,
I didn't see anything similar. Pity.

For hard line, OmniSpecta used to sell a steel block about 1 inch cube,
drilled to exactly fit each coax, with a slot on the side for a hacksaw
type blade (48 teeth/inch). The idea was that you sawed to the full depth
of the guide slot, rotated the cable a quarter turn, and repeated. This
resulted in nearly all of the dielectric cut (you'd finish with an Exacto
blade while twirling the coax in this fixture), and the center conductor
untouched. Hate to think how much Times Alumifoam I wasted by nicking
that center conductor. I don't think the idea was patented, but we had
the shop build a family of those blocks for all the hard line we used,
from 0.085 RG405/U up to 1 inch air line. We also had similar blocks
made to allow cutting the jacket without touching the outer (aluminum)
conductor of Times Alumifoam and Alumispline hard line.

Old guy

On Sun, 25 Dec 2005 17:54:59 -0600, (E-Mail Removed)
(Moe Trin) wrote:

>On Sat, 24 Dec 2005, in the Usenet newsgroup alt.internet.wireless, in article
><(E-Mail Removed)>, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
>
>Holiday Greetings!

Bah humbug. Why does it always rain on holidays and vacations?

>You mean something like the old Ideal 45-51x series? We used to buy
>the replacement blades direct, and in fairly large quantities. That
>would last for a while, but they aren't perishable.

http://www.lashen.com/vendors/ideal/...ols.asp#45-162
$10/ea for a replacemnt cartridge. It's one of the strippers I have
in the pile. I recall that these last about 20 connectors maximum for
LMR-400. That's $0.50 per connector in blades, if I can find the
blades. With a dull blade, I can do it faster and better with my
pocket knife and diagonal cutters.

>Klein Tools used to make a relatively nice one - I managed to loose the
>last one I had about five years ago. Last time I looked at their catalog,
>I didn't see anything similar. Pity.

I looked and didn't find anything. When I worked for Ma Bell in the
stone age of telephony, we used only Klein tools. Best tools ever
except possibly for the various Swiss manufacturers. Now that I have
to buy my own tools, I can't afford $50 pliers.

>For hard line, OmniSpecta used to sell a steel block about 1 inch cube,
>drilled to exactly fit each coax, with a slot on the side for a hacksaw
>type blade (48 teeth/inch). The idea was that you sawed to the full depth
>of the guide slot, rotated the cable a quarter turn, and repeated. This
>resulted in nearly all of the dielectric cut (you'd finish with an Exacto
>blade while twirling the coax in this fixture), and the center conductor
>untouched.

I have some hex blocks that work that way. Unfortunately nothing for
LMR-400. Most of mine are for various CATV cables. I've used these
and they do work fairly well. I don't do the finish with an Exacto
knife or razor. I have a few Teledyne thermal strippers to do the
job. Once through the jacket, aluminium foil, and braid, it's all
dielectric, which melts nicely (though smells awful). The thermal
stripper prevents nicking the center conductor. The only time this
doesn't work is with gel filled water proof coax (LMR-400-DB), which
tends to make a huge sticky mess no matter how it's stripped. For
those, I use a pipe cutter as I don't wanna spend the day cleaning my
tools.

>Hate to think how much Times Alumifoam I wasted by nicking
>that center conductor.

Use a hot wire. If you don't wanna spend the dollars on a thermal
stripper, just get a roll of nichrome heater repair wire from the
hardware store. Apply some current from an old plastic bag sealer
xformer until it's hot. Strangle the coax with a loop, and pull.
That's the way I do it in the field. The only cut that needs to be
made is through the foil and braid. The center conductor and the
jacket can be removed with a hot wire. The only reason I don't do use
this for everything is that I keep burning my fingers, which wrecks my
piano playing.

>I don't think the idea was patented, but we had
>the shop build a family of those blocks for all the hard line we used,
>from 0.085 RG405/U up to 1 inch air line. We also had similar blocks
>made to allow cutting the jacket without touching the outer (aluminum)
>conductor of Times Alumifoam and Alumispline hard line.

Yeah, that's what I was trying to avoid. However, I have access to a
machine shop so I'll probably have them build such a block. I'll see
if I can find some cheap steel rule die material for the cutters as I
don't like ripping through the braid with a hack saw blade.

Thanks.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 23:49:52 -0800, Jeff Liebermann
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 22:17:10 -0800, Bob Smith <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>I've used times connectors (EZcrimp & soldered) and times coax (LMR
>>etc) for about 10 years without any problems.
>

HI Jeff, long time no talk to,, hehe been busy, the hotspot business
on the mendo coast is crazy, I've install 12 in the past 3 months,
and got three more to go by the first of the year,, one is a goodie

AP ->to all rooms (almost
-> CPE ->AP to the rest of the rooms

I'm using interepoch stuff, it's great

anyway, back to the times info, I've been using the times tools for
about 4 years. I've got a set of tools for LMR400- & 600. two piece
stripper, center terminal 'pointer', and crimpers. I get the blades
from Electrocomm, they have to be ordered, your right, but I always
keep a spare set of blades in the tool box.

your right on the coax, so what I do is always spec times cable. A
contractor can do that, I usually get to spec out the parts to use in
ALL my systems, so times gets the vote. Your right the connectors do
cost more money, but the failure rate is NIL......

strip, trim, point, push, crimp, and melt the heat shrink, done job in
2-4 minutes,, and no comebacks, And the biggie is if your on a tower
or roof you CANT drop the center pin,,,,, hehe


Bob Smith
Robert Smith Consulting
Fort bragg, California

>What do you use for stripping the LMR-400? I have a small collection
>of plastic strippers, all with dull razor blades. The typical
>stripper will last for about 20 connectors. Replacement blades are
>advertised but always out of stock. The CATV strippers that I often
>use won't adjust to the LMR-400 diameters. I currently use a pocket
>knife and diagonal cutters, but that's too much work. I've considered
>making my own but that's rediculous.
>
>>I've seen people assemble this connector and
>>because the center conductor of the coax had a little bend they ended
>>up with a center pin off center when the connector was assembled.
>
>Not me. I have a different way to do it wrong. I crimp the
>connectors, at each end, while the LMR-400 is tightly coiled. When I
>straighten the coax, the center pins protrude excessively.
>
>Another great mistake is to believe the data sheet and assume that all
>types of LMR-400 are exactly 0.405" in diameter. I have some rubber
>jacket ultra-flex LMR-400 that is actually 0.415" in diameter and will
>just barely fit into the crimp ring sleeve for the RF Industries
>connectors.
>
>>You won't have this problem with the Times EZcrimp version.
>
>Agreed. They are great connectors. However, EZ-Crimp connectors are
>expensive at $13/ea versus about $3/ea (N-male to LMR-400) for the
>more common crimp connectors. See:
> http://www.fab-corp.com
>which carries both types.