Cannot find info on this product

I was looking at a purchase here:
http://www.bizsyscon.com/product.php?id=2820

But I have been unable to find much information on this product and no
user feedback. Has anyone used this radio or had experience with this
vendor?

I find it very unusal that I was unable to find ANY feedback from users
who bought this radio or it's cousins.
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Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)> hath wroth:

>I was looking at a purchase here:
>http://www.bizsyscon.com/product.php?id=2820
>
>But I have been unable to find much information on this product and no
>user feedback. Has anyone used this radio or had experience with this
>vendor?
>
>I find it very unusal that I was unable to find ANY feedback from users
>who bought this radio or it's cousins.

Neither could I. It's listed as a:
WAVEXSTREAM WXS-250B/G
There are also some for sale on eBay.

The FCC ID database never heard of the company or the product.
Ask the vendor for the FCC ID number.
That should be ummm.... interesting.

--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

<snip>

>>I find it very unusal that I was unable to find ANY feedback from
>>users who bought this radio or it's cousins.
>
> Neither could I. It's listed as a:
> WAVEXSTREAM WXS-250B/G
> There are also some for sale on eBay.
>
> The FCC ID database never heard of the company or the product.
> Ask the vendor for the FCC ID number.
> That should be ummm.... interesting.

Is this a legal requirement for them to sell the item? They claim they
make (my guess assemble) the radios themselves. Even so, still find it
funny that no one seems to have used them. New product on the shelves
last 6 months.


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Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)> hath wroth:

>Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>news:(E-Mail Removed) :
>
><snip>
>
>>>I find it very unusal that I was unable to find ANY feedback from
>>>users who bought this radio or it's cousins.
>>
>> Neither could I. It's listed as a:
>> WAVEXSTREAM WXS-250B/G
>> There are also some for sale on eBay.
>>
>> The FCC ID database never heard of the company or the product.
>> Ask the vendor for the FCC ID number.
>> That should be ummm.... interesting.

>Is this a legal requirement for them to sell the item? They claim they
>make (my guess assemble) the radios themselves. Even so, still find it
>funny that no one seems to have used them. New product on the shelves
>last 6 months.

Yes. Anything that belches RF sold in the USofA must pass various FCC
type certification tests. For 2.4GHz wirelss, it's FCC Part 15.
http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr15_01.html
http://www.fcc.gov/oet/info/rules/pa...15-2-16-06.pdf
That includes affixing a serial number tag to the unit that includes
the FCC ID number.
www.fcc.gov/oet/fccid/

In theory, the entire system needs to be type certified as a unit.
That means, power supply, coax cables, antenna, PoE box, and enclosure
all need to be tested per Part 15. If anything changes, it has to be
re-certified. Strictly speaking, taking the board out of a type
certified radio, and stuffing it in a different enclosure, requires
re-certification.

How about a $1 million "forfeiture" for selling digital audio
equipment without type certification?
http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-263862A1.html

How about $75,000 for forgetting to include a disclaimer that the
equipment was not yet type certified?
http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-253871A1.html


--
Jeff Liebermann (E-Mail Removed)
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

Here are the FCC numbers for the boards they are using:

ZINWELL ZWA-B191-ODM
ZINWELL ZWA-G192-ODM

But is that enough to get a good idea of the quality, reliability of the
radios they are building? Thanks for your opinion.


-------
Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

> Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)> hath wroth:
>
>>Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>>news:(E-Mail Removed) m:
>>
>><snip>
>>
>>>>I find it very unusal that I was unable to find ANY feedback from
>>>>users who bought this radio or it's cousins.
>>>
>>> Neither could I. It's listed as a:
>>> WAVEXSTREAM WXS-250B/G
>>> There are also some for sale on eBay.
>>>
>>> The FCC ID database never heard of the company or the product.
>>> Ask the vendor for the FCC ID number.
>>> That should be ummm.... interesting.
>
>>Is this a legal requirement for them to sell the item? They claim they
>>make (my guess assemble) the radios themselves. Even so, still find it
>>funny that no one seems to have used them. New product on the shelves
>>last 6 months.
>
> Yes. Anything that belches RF sold in the USofA must pass various FCC
> type certification tests. For 2.4GHz wirelss, it's FCC Part 15.
> http://www.access.gpo.gov/nara/cfr/w...7cfr15_01.html
> http://www.fcc.gov/oet/info/rules/pa...15-2-16-06.pdf
> That includes affixing a serial number tag to the unit that includes
> the FCC ID number.
> www.fcc.gov/oet/fccid/
>
> In theory, the entire system needs to be type certified as a unit.
> That means, power supply, coax cables, antenna, PoE box, and enclosure
> all need to be tested per Part 15. If anything changes, it has to be
> re-certified. Strictly speaking, taking the board out of a type
> certified radio, and stuffing it in a different enclosure, requires
> re-certification.
>
> How about a $1 million "forfeiture" for selling digital audio
> equipment without type certification?
> http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-263862A1.html
>
> How about $75,000 for forgetting to include a disclaimer that the
> equipment was not yet type certified?
> http://www.fcc.gov/eb/News_Releases/DOC-253871A1.html
>
>

On Tue, 11 Jul 2006 23:12:54 +0000 (UTC), Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>Here are the FCC numbers for the boards they are using:
>
>ZINWELL ZWA-B191-ODM
>ZINWELL ZWA-G192-ODM

I couldn't find these in the FCC ID search page.
There is no ZWA vendor code.
It's either a counterfeit FCC ID or typo error.
Where did you get those ID numbers?

There is a Zinwell listed in the Grantee search.
However, their FCC ID prefix is RIW, and not ZWA.
Using RIW as a search key, I found some products that resemble the
items in the photographs. See:
https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/c...ericSearch.cfm
and insert "RIW" in the "grantee code" box. There are 7 products (and
1 modification) listed.

You can tell quite a bit about the product from the photos and the
test reports. If this is what they're selling, then it's probably
legal.

Checking RIW-G192-OD (note the different numbers), it's certainly a
high power 802.11g unit certified with 3, 6, and 9dBi omni antennas at
approx +24dBm for 802.11b and +20dB for 802.11g.

>But is that enough to get a good idea of the quality, reliability of the
>radios they are building? Thanks for your opinion.

No. From the tests, the transmitter looks typical. Nothing odd or
obviously wrong. However, there are no receiver tests for FCC type
certification, so I can't tell how well or badly that will work. Also,
nothing on features, ease of configuration, user interface,
reliability, environmental issues, and PoE.

--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558 (E-Mail Removed)
# http://802.11junk.com (E-Mail Removed)
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS

Thanks very much Jeff for taking time to look this up. More below-

Jeff Liebermann <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

> On Tue, 11 Jul 2006 23:12:54 +0000 (UTC), Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)>
> wrote:
>
>>Here are the FCC numbers for the boards they are using:
>>
>>ZINWELL ZWA-B191-ODM
>>ZINWELL ZWA-G192-ODM
>
> I couldn't find these in the FCC ID search page.
> There is no ZWA vendor code.
> It's either a counterfeit FCC ID or typo error.
> Where did you get those ID numbers?

From the guys that are selling them, see the OP url I gave.
I found a manual for it at:
http://www.pasadena.net/store/G192%20Manual_130.pdf
Also check: http://www.zcwc.com/zcwc/products/in...ip_wlan.shtml#

Vendor claims these receive sensitivity figures:

WXS-250B is: -87 dBm +/- 2 dB (11 Mbps) @ 8% PER
WXS-250B/G its: -69 dBm +/- 2 dB (54 Mbps) @ 10% PER

Among others am trying to compare these radios to Senao 2611 and 3220
radios. What do you think?

>
> There is a Zinwell listed in the Grantee search.
> However, their FCC ID prefix is RIW, and not ZWA.
> Using RIW as a search key, I found some products that resemble the
> items in the photographs. See:
> https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/c...ericSearch.cfm
> and insert "RIW" in the "grantee code" box. There are 7 products (and
> 1 modification) listed.
>
> You can tell quite a bit about the product from the photos and the
> test reports. If this is what they're selling, then it's probably
> legal.
>
> Checking RIW-G192-OD (note the different numbers), it's certainly a
> high power 802.11g unit certified with 3, 6, and 9dBi omni antennas at
> approx +24dBm for 802.11b and +20dB for 802.11g.

Since I can find NO user feedback on them; sans a recommendation for
you, I am inclined to lose interest at this point. I used a good search
program and could find zilch on user comments. Only thing available was
sales promotional material and sketchy.

>
>>But is that enough to get a good idea of the quality, reliability of
>>the radios they are building? Thanks for your opinion.
>
> No. From the tests, the transmitter looks typical. Nothing odd or
> obviously wrong. However, there are no receiver tests for FCC type
> certification, so I can't tell how well or badly that will work. Also,
> nothing on features, ease of configuration, user interface,
> reliability, environmental issues, and PoE.
>

On Wed, 12 Jul 2006 22:37:38 +0000 (UTC), Arnie <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>I found a manual for it at:
>http://www.pasadena.net/store/G192%20Manual_130.pdf

Pasadena.net is the same as:
http://www.wlanparts.com
You might want to give Frank Keeney a call.

I read through all 77 pages of the manual. The English is predictably
horrible. There are quite a few useful features. Basically, the
device can be configured to do just about anything. It's apparently
running some version of Linux. It incluses a command line interface
with SSH login, SNMP, QoS, bandwidth management of sorts, repeater,
WDS, etc. That's just about anything one could want, if it works. The
only thing I could see missing is WPA2. The list of OID's supported
by SNMP are better than most and include signal strength (which is
usually missing). I would say it's a rather nice product, if it
works. Ask them for the Linux source code.

>Also check: http://www.zcwc.com/zcwc/products/in...ip_wlan.shtml#

Comparing features with the new ZW-2000–OD 802.11g, the major
differences are no PoE, and includes WPA2/802.11i.

>Vendor claims these receive sensitivity figures:
>
>WXS-250B is: -87 dBm +/- 2 dB (11 Mbps) @ 8% PER
>WXS-250B/G its: -69 dBm +/- 2 dB (54 Mbps) @ 10% PER

That's fairly close to typical.
I use -68dBm for 54Mbit/sec and -82 for 11Mbits/sec.
The 11Mbits/sec spec seems a bit too good, but there may have been
improvements in chipsets and sensitivity since I ran the numbers about
4 years ago.

>Among others am trying to compare these radios to Senao 2611 and 3220
>radios. What do you think?

No comment or experience with these radios. Sorry.

>Since I can find NO user feedback on them; sans a recommendation for
>you, I am inclined to lose interest at this point. I used a good search
>program and could find zilch on user comments. Only thing available was
>sales promotional material and sketchy.

Someone has to be first. If you don't want to be a pioneer, then
don't do it.



--
# Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060
# 831-336-2558 (E-Mail Removed)
# http://802.11junk.com (E-Mail Removed)
# http://www.LearnByDestroying.com AE6KS