Broadband works :-) but windows printer and file sharing doesn't :-(

I have just changed to broadband and my main machine quite happily
sees the internet. I say my main machine as I have two laptops which I
use on a local network to share the printers and files and CDs on the
desktop machine. My previous system used a local hub with one port
connected to linux firewall and from there to a modem. This all
worked.

I have now replaced the local hub, linux firewall and modem with an
ADSL router modem and appear to have lost the ability to share
directories, drives or printers. The router modem I have is a borrowed
generic no name device (the box just says 'mentor ADSL router' on it)
which I was using to test everything before getting (probably) a DLINK
504, but I don't want to spend any money on that without understanding
the problem in case it will just display the same problem.

i.e.

This worked

+-- laptop (linux)
|
+-- laptop (98)
|
Modem -- Linux -- Hub --+-- desktop (xp) -- printer / CDR
|
+-- desktop (linux)

with the laptops seeing the printer and CD and and the desktop seeing
the internet.

This doesn't work

+-- laptop (linux)
|
+-- laptop (98)
|
ADSL router --+-- desktop (xp)-- printer / CDR
|
+-- desktop (linux)

The desktop can now see the internet much more effectvely but windows
no longer shares the printer or CD.

The best hyopthesis I have at the moment is that the router is
blocking all NetBeui traffic on the LAN rather than blocking NetBeui
from going across the firewall. But that is only a hypothesis as I'm
running out of my skill set at this point.

Everything on the LAN can ping everything else. Everything on the LAN
is assigned a static IP and uses the router as its gateway. No
configuration was change on any of the client machines as the router
was assigned the same IP as the previous linux firewall.

In case the router was blocking something I have tried putting the hub
between the router and LAN but that does not change anything. It is
almost as though all traffic is being sent via the gateway even if
bound for the local subnet and the router is then blocking it.

Any suggestions on what I should be looking at to make windows share
it's printers?

TIA

No_spam_please wrote:
>
> The best hyopthesis I have at the moment is that the router is
> blocking all NetBeui traffic on the LAN rather than blocking NetBeui
> from going across the firewall. But that is only a hypothesis as I'm
> running out of my skill set at this point.
>
> Everything on the LAN can ping everything else. Everything on the LAN
> is assigned a static IP and uses the router as its gateway. No
> configuration was change on any of the client machines as the router
> was assigned the same IP as the previous linux firewall.
>

Try forcing your windows network setting to have "NETBIOS enabled over
TCP/IP".

Good luck

--
Andy

On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 10:45:28 -0000, "Andy Ashworth"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Try forcing your windows network setting to have "NETBIOS enabled over
>TCP/IP".

Doesn't that just potentially allow all the windows boxes to be
attached from the internet? As this worked when linux handled the
routing surely it should be a router configuration problem (even if
that means that I need a router with a specific feature to allow this)

On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 10:45:28 -0000, "Andy Ashworth"
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Try forcing your windows network setting to have "NETBIOS enabled over
>TCP/IP".

Doesn't that make the windows boxes more prone to attack from the
internet? As this worked when linux handled the routing it seems that
the solution should be in the router configuration (even if that means
getting a router with a specific feature) rather than making the
windows boxes even more vulnerable.

No_spam_please wrote:
> On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 10:45:28 -0000, "Andy Ashworth"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> Try forcing your windows network setting to have "NETBIOS enabled
>> over TCP/IP".
>
> Doesn't that make the windows boxes more prone to attack from the
> internet? As this worked when linux handled the routing it seems that
> the solution should be in the router configuration (even if that means
> getting a router with a specific feature) rather than making the
> windows boxes even more vulnerable.

That depends on how your router is set up - my own set-up is using an EN5861
router/ADSL modem which supports NAT and also has a packet filtering
firewall. Before I added the router I relied on the default settings which
has NETBIOS based on DHCP policy, i.e. it may or may not have been set. If
your router is being used as a DHCP server for your local network, then you
may find that the setting is different from your previous configuration.

Good luck!

--
Andy

On 15 Dec 2003 14:03 GMT, (No_spam_please) wrote:

>Doesn't that just potentially allow all the windows boxes to be
>attached from the internet?

Assuming your LAN IP addresses are "local" (eg 10.0.0.x) and your
router is using NAT, then the rest of the internet isn't seeing
any of your local PCs unless they request particular services,
such as using FTP, mail, or seeking web pages, and when the PCs
make a request for something the router will request, and pass any
data back to your PC. Port forwarding (which allows you to define
how external requests can reach local PCs) does expose the PCs to
a chance of attack, but in general a router "hides" your PCs if
used with NAT (use Google for a detailed explanation of Network
Address Translation). Try the "Shields Up!" test on www.grc.com
(OK, it may not be the best site, some consider the owner in a
bad light, but the Shields Up! test is a quick and dirty (free)
check you can use to see if your PCs are "exposed"). Peter M.

On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 10:35:51 +0000, wrote:

>
>
> This worked
>
> +-- laptop (linux)
> |
> +-- laptop (98)
> |
> Modem -- Linux -- Hub --+-- desktop (xp) -- printer / CDR
> |
> +-- desktop (linux)
>
> with the laptops seeing the printer and CD and and the desktop seeing the
> internet.
>
> This doesn't work
>
> +-- laptop (linux)
> |
> +-- laptop (98)
> |
> ADSL router --+-- desktop (xp)-- printer / CDR
> |
> +-- desktop (linux)
>



My guess is that you have DHCP enabled on the router. This is no problem
if it is set up correctly and no other DHCP server is running on your
network, both Linux and WinXP can act as a DHCP server. The router plays no
part in your local file sharing, it should just ignore it. If you really
want to check this, simply unplug the router from the hub. Can you share
files now?

Hope this helps, Graham

Graham wrote:
> My guess is that you have DHCP enabled on the router. This is no problem
> if it is set up correctly and no other DHCP server is running on your
> network, both Linux and WinXP can act as a DHCP server. The router plays no
> part in your local file sharing, it should just ignore it. If you really
> want to check this, simply unplug the router from the hub. Can you share
> files now?

DHCP has been disabled on the router with so few machines it is viable
to give everything a static IP. I have tried putting the hub back
in but printer and file sharing is still disabled. If I remove the
router from the hub and then reboot the PCs printer and file sharing is
available again. So it is definitely a problem in the router but I am
stumped for the moment as to what that problem is and so what to look
for in a router to overcome the problem.

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 20:27:12 +0000, new wrote:

> Graham wrote:
>> My guess is that you have DHCP enabled on the router. This is no problem
>> if it is set up correctly and no other DHCP server is running on your
>> network, both Linux and WinXP can act as a DHCP server. The router plays
>> no part in your local file sharing, it should just ignore it. If you
>> really want to check this, simply unplug the router from the hub. Can
>> you share files now?
>
> DHCP has been disabled on the router with so few machines it is viable to
> give everything a static IP. I have tried putting the hub back in but
> printer and file sharing is still disabled. If I remove the router from
> the hub and then reboot the PCs printer and file sharing is available
> again. So it is definitely a problem in the router but I am stumped for
> the moment as to what that problem is and so what to look for in a router
> to overcome the problem.

A few further thoughts.

Can you ping between the PC's when the router is in place?
IP address scheme not configured correctly.

Is the router's ethernet hub faulty?
Try using your existing hub with the router plugged into one of the spare
ports using a crossover cable/crossover port.

Was the removed linux box providing DNS or browsmaster services for your
network that has now been removed?
Configure one of the other machines to take over the missing service(s).

Graham.

In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, ?@?.?.invalid writes
>I have just changed to broadband and my main machine quite happily
>sees the internet. I say my main machine as I have two laptops which I
>use on a local network to share the printers and files and CDs on the
>desktop machine. My previous system used a local hub with one port
>connected to linux firewall and from there to a modem. This all
>worked.
>
>I have now replaced the local hub, linux firewall and modem with an
>ADSL router modem and appear to have lost the ability to share
>directories, drives or printers. The router modem I have is a borrowed
>generic no name device (the box just says 'mentor ADSL router' on it)
>which I was using to test everything before getting (probably) a DLINK
>504, but I don't want to spend any money on that without understanding
>the problem in case it will just display the same problem.


Hi,

Don't know if this is the same problem, I have four PCs connected to a
router and was having problems seeing other PCs and sharing the printer.
The reason turned out to be the software firewall on one PC if it was
the first to boot up on the network. I was stopping all requests to that
machine from anywhere ( firewall settings ) and as it was the dominant
machine it was stopping all the others from seeing each other.

Mike
--
Mike Guess