Broadband on some sockets but not others

I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky fo
phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots o
phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I hav
identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. Howeve
only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room
pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built i
ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The othe
set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with an
without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in th
lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.

My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And mor
importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other socket
- specifically the one in the lounge where I need it


--
Bunty

On 24/02/2011 18:31, Bunty wrote:
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.
>
>
>
>

Hi Bunty,

the one with the built in filter is quite likely the master socket, and
filters ADSL signals out before they get to the other ones. If that's a
BT master socket I think you have a problem - real money to move it.
Think about using a wireless connection into the lounge, or a network
cable with the router near the master socket.

Others who know more will be along later.

Andy

On 24/02/11 18:31, Bunty wrote:
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.

Most likely the non broadband sockets are provisioned from the filtered
or "phone only" side of whichever socket has the built in filtering.

The answer to both your questions is yes.

Filters go between the exchange - adsl modem connection and the telephone.

(Yes, I know some filters are more complex than this)

With a hard wired filter, what you get is something like this:

Exchange <--X--+--> adsl modem
|
[Filter]
|
+--> phone 1
|
+--> phone 2
|
+--> phone 3
|
+--> phone 4
|
+--> phone 5

The filter and adsl modem socket and phone 1 socket may be incorporated
in a single item.

X is the master socket. It can be combined with the filter, phone 1 and
adsl modem sockets.

With microfilters, you get something more like this:

Exchange <--X--+--> adsl modem
|
+--> [microfilter] <--> phone 1
|
+--> [microfilter] <--> phone 2
|
+--> [microfilter] <--> phone 3
|
+--> [microfilter] <--> phone 4
|
+--> [microfilter] <--> phone 5

(Yes, I know you may use a microfilter to connect your RJ11 adsl modem
plug to the BT 431A socket, but it's not actually doing any filtering
when you do that, it's just acting as a converter from BT431A to RJ11)

What you need to do is configure your internal wiring so that:

(a) There is a single unbroken length of at least telephone grade
twisted pair between the master socket X and the filter.

(b) If needed, there is a single unbroken length of at least telephone
grade twisted pair between the unfiltered side of the filter and the
socket you wish to plug your adsl into. (If possible, relocate the
filter to the location that you wish to connect the dsl, so that this is
not needed!)

(c) The sockets that you wish to use for telephony are connected in
parallel on the filtered side of the filter.

Any extraneous connections between the master socket and the filter, or
between the filter and the adsl modem, will degrade the adsl signal. The
more connections and teed off spurs you have, the worse it will be. This
is why, if you can, it is better to use a single master filter rather
than a microfilter on each phone.

Rgds

Denis McMahon

"Bunty" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Bunty

Either the sockets have filters in the master (e.g. NTE5 or 5A) or one
downstream has a sub plate and only passes filtered.

You need to identify where this is happening and replace it with a plain
vanilla face plate(s), you will then need plug in filter(s).

Might be best to keep the router where the BT line enters the house and run
Cat5e cable to where you need service.

"Bunty" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to
> sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has
> lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but
> I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out.
> However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one
> room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has
> built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The
> other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried
> with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal
> socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue?
> And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other
> sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Bunty
>



Two possibilites.

The sockets on which you cannot get broadband have been wired
with other than twisted-pair solid wire telephone cable. If they
have been wired with flat parallel or burglar alarm cable then
the RF that carries the broadband will be lost very quickly.

Technically you should not have a REN of more than 4 on a single
telephone line and since most phones have a REN of 1 (ringing
equivalence number) and you have at least five sockets, is it
possible there is a ringing booster hidden away somewhere? These
are notorious for being broadband blockers.

A final thought: if you have sockets that don't work, did the
previous occupant have cable phone as a second line - if you are
in a cabled area - which has been ceased?



--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

On 24/02/2011 18:31, Bunty wrote:
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.
>
>
>
>
Are you sure that you've only got one phone line, rather than two - with
ADSL enabled on only one of them? [If you plug a phone into each socket
in turn, and dial 17070, do they all report the same phone number?]

Assuming that there *is* only one line, it sounds like you've got a
filtered faceplate similar to
http://www.clarity.it/xcart/home.php?cat=262 [1] in your master socket,
which filters all the extension wiring to separate the phones from the
ADSL signal. If this is the case, ADSL will only work when you plug your
modem/router into the ADSL outlet on the filtered faceplate.

If it's a fairly recent filtered faceplace, it will probably have a pair
of unfiltered terminals on the back, in addition to the filtered
terminals to which your extension wiring is connected. In this case,
what you need to do run an unfiltered extension cable from those
terminals to the point where you want to connect your ADSL equipment,
and terminate it with an RJ11[2] socket rather than a normal BT socket.

[1] It would help to be sure if you could upload a photo of any
socket(s) where ADSL *does* work, and post a link here.
[2] You'll see one if you scroll down the page in the Clarity link, above
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, "Bunty" wrote:
>
> I recently moved house to an older property and subscribed to sky for
> phone and broadband which has now been activated. House has lots of
> phone sockets around the place, many of which are inactive but I have
> identified 5 that are live and can be used to telephone out. However
> only 2 seem to be carrying broadband.
> Basically there are two double sets of phone sockets in one room (
> pressumably used as a home office at some point ). One set has built in
> ADSL filtering and my router finds broadband on these fine. The other
> set are normal phone sockets and I get no broadband ( tried with and
> without detachable ADSL filter). Same on the single normal socket in the
> lounge. All 5 can be used fine to phone.
>
> My question is, is this likely to be a deliberate wiring issue? And more
> importanly, can it be corrected to carry broadband to the other sockets
> - specifically the one in the lounge where I need it.

That's a common set-up. As others have said, it sounds like you have a
master socket either in your home office or you haven't yet found it.
This has an "ADSL filter" that removes the ADSL signal from the phone-
type connections, including those for devices with old analog modems in
them. One of your slave sockets is connected to the unfiltered side so
the ADSL router can be installed remotely from the master socket. There
are a couple of punch-down connections on the back of the faceplate,
normally labelled "A" and "B" used to extend the ADSL-carrying wiring,
(The phone only wiring is on 3 connections 2, 3 and 5, where "3" is the
bell wire that can be disconnected when using modern phones, which may
improve the ADSL performance.)

The only thing to remember is if you connect a non-ADSL device in the
home office, you have to use plug-in micro filters or equivalent in the
ADSL-carrying sockets, if the socket there doesn't have both BT and RJ
sockets.

You can extend the ADSL-carrying wiring to another socket remote from the
master by transferring the wiring going to that socket from 2 and 5 to A
and B, PROVIDING there are no more than 2 wires already in the A and B
connectors.

If you want to do a proper job, filter all the phone sockets at the
master, so you have no ADSL on any of your phone wiring and plug in your
router directly into the Master's "ADSL" socket. Then install a CAT5E
cable network to separately installed RJ45 Ethernet sockets where needed.
This will be good for a 1Gb LAN network, if you install a Gb switch at
the star point where all your CAT5E cables are routed. (Ethernet sockets
can't be connected in parallel) If you have to install the router
remotely from the master socket, replace its RJ11 cable with a long,
screened twisted-pair type so you can still plug it into the master
socket (see www.adslnation.com shop).

Be warned that an old house may have interior wall construction that
partly screens each room from the Wireless network signals so a wired
network of some sort may be your only solution.

--
John W

Many thanks John - and everyone else who replied. All very useful info
and I am now much clearer about what my options are. Cheers All!




--
Bunty