Bridging two wired networks via wireless router and NIC

My home network has five computers and two routers:

Router #1 has the Internet, VoIP Phone, and DHCP Server. It is connected
directly to the DSL modem and dials out via PPPoE through the ethernet port.
IP: 192.168.0.252

Router #2 has the 802.11g wireless radio, DHCP disabled, and otherwise acts
like a dumb ethernet switch connected via ethernet to a LAN port of Router
#1. IP: 192.168.0.253

Computers A, B, and C are connected to Router #2 via ethernet and are
configured to use the DHCP which works fine.

The problem is that computers D and E are situated on the other side of the
house, and only D gets reliable signal reception even with a Linksys SRX
wireless NIC.

Computer D has the wireless adapter and an ethernet adapter. Both adapters
are configured to use DHCP.

Computer E has an ethernet port (nForce 4) which is configured to use DHCP.

Now, here's the problem. I want the following:

E <-> ethernet <-> Bridge on D <-> wireless <-> Router #2...

From what I have read this should put all computers on the 192.168.0.xxx
subnet with DHCP-assigned addresses from Router #1. But it doesn't work, and
I can't find any troubleshooting for this on the Internet.

The bridge on computer D establishes itself, acquires its MAC address and
DHCP information from the wireless adapter, and reports that everything is
OK; however, it cannot ping any computers or routers on the wireless side of
the bridge. Neither Internet access nor network shares work.

The status windows for the bridge, wired, and wireless connections show that
packets are being sent and received to varying degrees when I try to ping the
routers and the other computers. But the pings will timeout and tracert will
just sit there for what seems like an eternity.

The computers are running XP SP2, BTW.

What can I do? Are there any troubleshooting steps I can take to narrow the
problem down? If this is a Linksys issue, then I want more specific
information to give them.


Before you ask:

The promiscuous mode fix on D's wireless adapter did not change anything.

Using ICS on D is not acceptable; D and C are PVRs (SageTV) and need to see
each other and the rest of the home network so that they can share recorded
shows and live TV feeds.

Ok, first thing I need to know, is, do you have a crossover cable? between D
and E?
That could be the major problem right now.
Other than that, I'm doing pretty much the same thing right now... using my
laptop as the wireless "card" bridged to a computer...
some ways you can over come this is by:
A) buy another router and connect it that WAN to the wireless computer...
and all other computers to it... but why not spring for the wireless
repeater if you're going to do that? ;-) unless you have one lying around
(like I do)
B) using a crossover cable to connect the two computers D and E bridging the
networks on D.

Then everything should work. ;-) Good luck.
BTW, promiscuos mode only does stuff for sniffers (or hackers)... nothing
workable for usage like that... IMO

-James G.


"null_pointer_us" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:B2563932-E460-4156-9799-(E-Mail Removed)...
> My home network has five computers and two routers:
>
> Router #1 has the Internet, VoIP Phone, and DHCP Server. It is connected
> directly to the DSL modem and dials out via PPPoE through the ethernet
> port.
> IP: 192.168.0.252
>
> Router #2 has the 802.11g wireless radio, DHCP disabled, and otherwise
> acts
> like a dumb ethernet switch connected via ethernet to a LAN port of Router
> #1. IP: 192.168.0.253
>
> Computers A, B, and C are connected to Router #2 via ethernet and are
> configured to use the DHCP which works fine.
>
> The problem is that computers D and E are situated on the other side of
> the
> house, and only D gets reliable signal reception even with a Linksys SRX
> wireless NIC.
>
> Computer D has the wireless adapter and an ethernet adapter. Both adapters
> are configured to use DHCP.
>
> Computer E has an ethernet port (nForce 4) which is configured to use
> DHCP.
>
> Now, here's the problem. I want the following:
>
> E <-> ethernet <-> Bridge on D <-> wireless <-> Router #2...
>
> From what I have read this should put all computers on the 192.168.0.xxx
> subnet with DHCP-assigned addresses from Router #1. But it doesn't work,
> and
> I can't find any troubleshooting for this on the Internet.
>
> The bridge on computer D establishes itself, acquires its MAC address and
> DHCP information from the wireless adapter, and reports that everything is
> OK; however, it cannot ping any computers or routers on the wireless side
> of
> the bridge. Neither Internet access nor network shares work.
>
> The status windows for the bridge, wired, and wireless connections show
> that
> packets are being sent and received to varying degrees when I try to ping
> the
> routers and the other computers. But the pings will timeout and tracert
> will
> just sit there for what seems like an eternity.
>
> The computers are running XP SP2, BTW.
>
> What can I do? Are there any troubleshooting steps I can take to narrow
> the
> problem down? If this is a Linksys issue, then I want more specific
> information to give them.
>
>
> Before you ask:
>
> The promiscuous mode fix on D's wireless adapter did not change anything.
>
> Using ICS on D is not acceptable; D and C are PVRs (SageTV) and need to
> see
> each other and the rest of the home network so that they can share
> recorded
> shows and live TV feeds.

Thanks for your quick response, James!

"James Gockel" wrote:

> Ok, first thing I need to know, is, do you have a crossover cable? between D
> and E?
> That could be the major problem right now.

Why would I need a crossover cable? Using a standard cable, ICS on D seems
to work fine in lieu of a XP bridge with the exception that neither D nor E
can see the other computers on the home network.

In any case, I have a spare switch and a 3' ethernet cable which should take
the place of a cross-over cable...I'll give this a try tomorrow.

> Other than that, I'm doing pretty much the same thing right now... using my
> laptop as the wireless "card" bridged to a computer...
> some ways you can over come this is by:
> A) buy another router and connect it that WAN to the wireless computer...
> and all other computers to it... but why not spring for the wireless
> repeater if you're going to do that? ;-) unless you have one lying around
> (like I do)
> B) using a crossover cable to connect the two computers D and E bridging the
> networks on D.
>
> Then everything should work. ;-) Good luck.

I'm not sure what you are suggesting, but I have two wired networks which
cannot be connected without using some form of wireless technology between
them.

To clarify, there are two locations within the house:

On one side of the house:
DSL Modem
Router #1 (VoIP)
Router #2 (wireless and ethernet)
Computer A
Computer B
Computer C

On the other side of the house:
Computer D
Computer E

No cables can bridge the two separate locations. The head of the house says
so "no" (very emphatically) to running cables between them (although 100 ft.
CAT-5 would probably do it).

Also, E cannot get a good wireless signal to the wireless router on the
other end of the house. The signal would have to travel through the
entertainment center, the kitchen, and quite a few walls (since we're going
diagonally). Blame the architect and the cable installer. But really, houses
should be wired for ethernet...

For this reason, E must have a wired connection to D, and D must have a
wireless connection to the rest of the network.

BTW, I have a spare wireless router and two spare wireless NICs lying around
in case that opens up some more options.

> BTW, promiscuos mode only does stuff for sniffers (or hackers)... nothing
> workable for usage like that... IMO

I was referring to the promiscuous mode problem in the MS KB which can
prevent some wireless NICs from working in an XP network bridge.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302348/en-us

Just ignore the last part of the message, it was a tangent I went on. I just
meant that my network sounds similar to your situation. I have it like this

<E> = Connected by CAT5 Ethernet
<W> = Connected Wirelessly

DSL Modem
|
->Wireless Router
|
|-> <E> Laptop A
|-> <E> Printer A
|-> <W> Computer A (Sharing Printer B)
|-> <W> Computer B
|-> <W> Laptop B
-> <W> Laptop C (mine) (Bridged Wireless and Ethernet)
| Into wan port, so crossover isnt needed.
-> <E> Router
|
-> <E> Computer C

If you were to connect, in mycase, Laptop C and Computer C directly you'd
need a crossover cable.

I think a crossover cable or a switch should work, in your case. Should be
simple =)
-James G.



"null_pointer_us" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:AC41E0DA-9ADF-40E0-B8FB-(E-Mail Removed)...
> Thanks for your quick response, James!
>
> "James Gockel" wrote:
>
>> Ok, first thing I need to know, is, do you have a crossover cable?
>> between D
>> and E?
>> That could be the major problem right now.
>
> Why would I need a crossover cable? Using a standard cable, ICS on D seems
> to work fine in lieu of a XP bridge with the exception that neither D nor
> E
> can see the other computers on the home network.
>
> In any case, I have a spare switch and a 3' ethernet cable which should
> take
> the place of a cross-over cable...I'll give this a try tomorrow.
>
>> Other than that, I'm doing pretty much the same thing right now... using
>> my
>> laptop as the wireless "card" bridged to a computer...
>> some ways you can over come this is by:
>> A) buy another router and connect it that WAN to the wireless computer...
>> and all other computers to it... but why not spring for the wireless
>> repeater if you're going to do that? ;-) unless you have one lying around
>> (like I do)
>> B) using a crossover cable to connect the two computers D and E bridging
>> the
>> networks on D.
>>
>> Then everything should work. ;-) Good luck.
>
> I'm not sure what you are suggesting, but I have two wired networks which
> cannot be connected without using some form of wireless technology between
> them.
>
> To clarify, there are two locations within the house:
>
> On one side of the house:
> DSL Modem
> Router #1 (VoIP)
> Router #2 (wireless and ethernet)
> Computer A
> Computer B
> Computer C
>
> On the other side of the house:
> Computer D
> Computer E
>
> No cables can bridge the two separate locations. The head of the house
> says
> so "no" (very emphatically) to running cables between them (although 100
> ft.
> CAT-5 would probably do it).
>
> Also, E cannot get a good wireless signal to the wireless router on the
> other end of the house. The signal would have to travel through the
> entertainment center, the kitchen, and quite a few walls (since we're
> going
> diagonally). Blame the architect and the cable installer. But really,
> houses
> should be wired for ethernet...
>
> For this reason, E must have a wired connection to D, and D must have a
> wireless connection to the rest of the network.
>
> BTW, I have a spare wireless router and two spare wireless NICs lying
> around
> in case that opens up some more options.
>
>> BTW, promiscuos mode only does stuff for sniffers (or hackers)... nothing
>> workable for usage like that... IMO
>
> I was referring to the promiscuous mode problem in the MS KB which can
> prevent some wireless NICs from working in an XP network bridge.
>
> http://support.microsoft.com/kb/302348/en-us

"James Gockel" wrote:

> Just ignore the last part of the message, it was a tangent I went on. I just
> meant that my network sounds similar to your situation. I have it like this
>
> <E> = Connected by CAT5 Ethernet
> <W> = Connected Wirelessly
>
> DSL Modem
> |
> ->Wireless Router
> |
> |-> <E> Laptop A
> |-> <E> Printer A
> |-> <W> Computer A (Sharing Printer B)
> |-> <W> Computer B
> |-> <W> Laptop B
> -> <W> Laptop C (mine) (Bridged Wireless and Ethernet)
> | Into wan port, so crossover isnt needed.
> -> <E> Router
> |
> -> <E> Computer C
>
> If you were to connect, in mycase, Laptop C and Computer C directly you'd
> need a crossover cable.
>
> I think a crossover cable or a switch should work, in your case. Should be
> simple =)

OK, I understand now. Thanks for the advice!

Heh, success at last.

So the following combinations:

[wireless router] -> [wireless NIC #1 -> (xp bridge) <- ethernet NIC] ->
[internet router]
[wireless router] -> [wireless NIC #2 -> (xp bridge) <- ethernet NIC] ->
[internet router]
[wireless router] -> [ethernet NIC -> (xp bridge) <- wireless NIC #2] ->
[internet router]

do not work. Specifically, the computer with the bridged connection is never
able to ping both routers successfully. The promiscuous mode fix does not
help here.

However, this combination:

[wireless router] -> [ethernet NIC -> (xp bridge) <- wireless NIC #1] ->
[internet router]

does work if I toggle the forcecompatmode option with the proper timing. Cool!

But then it fails after a day or so. I have the XP bridge set to a static
IP, so it's not a DHCP lease issue. The wireless NIC #1 just loses its
ability to communicate with the wireless router, and toggling the
forcecompatmode seems like the only way to fix it. DNS lookups are slow as
heck right now - we're talking > 5 seconds.

Hey, look at that!!! I tried to ping my ISP's name servers from behind the
bridge about five minutes ago with an infinite timeout period, and the first
ping just succeeded. Yay. Now I wonder why I get DNS lookups faster than I
can ping the DNS servers. Perhaps the connection times out and then pulls
values from a cache.

I will start an email discussion Linksys to resolve these problems. Most
likely there are simply bugs in the wireless router and wireless NICs'
firmware that need to be pointed out and fixed.

For future reference, my Linksys hardware is as follows:

RT31P2 (works fine with the bridge)
WRT54G (works fine on the non-Internet side of the bridge)
WUSB54G (works fine on the Internet side of the bridge)
WMP54GX (doesn't work with the bridge on either side)

(Cross your fingers!)

> I will start an email discussion Linksys to resolve these problems. Most
> likely there are simply bugs in the wireless router and wireless NICs'
> firmware that need to be pointed out and fixed.

Linksys says that only ad-hoc and infrastructure modes are supported on
their wireless NICs; instead of fixing the driver bugs, however, they offered
to let me buy a hardware bridge. Gee, how nice of them. And do you know how
many bridges Linksys sells with SRX technology? Zero. Looks like eBay will be
getting some more business soon...