Another HH -> ADSL Question

Afternoon all,

Currently on HH and looking to move to ADSL - I do want to keep my
second analogue number so regardless of what I do it does mean a second
line with that number transfered to it.

Current BT line check says we should be OK for 2MB prior to checks etc
etc.

My prefered route is to have a 2nd line now and transfer the number over
whilst still keeping HH for the short term (BT will renumber the 2nd
analogue line). I have to hope that this second line will be OK for ADSL
and then have BT take HH off the line - if not have to hope that when HH
comes put ADSL can go on that.

I could go a migrated route and try to get BT to add a new line order on
the back of that to be done at the same time but I prefer the idea of
being able to change over in my own time rather than all at one time on
the same day.

I'm risking a new second line though on the fact I will be able to get
ADSL on either that or my current line - has anybody any experience of
a BT line check suggesting your OK for 2MB only to find that when push
came to shove they couldn't ?

Many thanks for any input.

On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:05:02 +0000, (E-Mail Removed)
wrote:

>Afternoon all,
>
>Currently on HH and looking to move to ADSL - I do want to keep my
>second analogue number so regardless of what I do it does mean a second
>line with that number transfered to it.
>
>Current BT line check says we should be OK for 2MB prior to checks etc
>etc.
>
>My prefered route is to have a 2nd line now and transfer the number over
>whilst still keeping HH for the short term (BT will renumber the 2nd
>analogue line). I have to hope that this second line will be OK for ADSL
>and then have BT take HH off the line - if not have to hope that when HH
>comes put ADSL can go on that.
>
>I could go a migrated route and try to get BT to add a new line order on
>the back of that to be done at the same time but I prefer the idea of
>being able to change over in my own time rather than all at one time on
>the same day.
>
>I'm risking a new second line though on the fact I will be able to get
>ADSL on either that or my current line - has anybody any experience of
>a BT line check suggesting your OK for 2MB only to find that when push
>came to shove they couldn't ?
>
>Many thanks for any input.

I may be wromg but it seems to me that your approach has some fatal
flaws. If you have a new line installed to which ADSL is applied
then, so far as I am aware, if the number is chaged then the ADSL
facility is lost and a fresh application has to be made for the ADSL
service with all the associated costs and delay.

I also have a gut feeling the while a line can be 'downgraded' to an
analogue service [for a fee], thus retaining the primary number, you
can't have the choice of having the 2nd or 3rd numbers that were
associated with the HH service.

You can have your previous numbers automatically ported to your new
line number but the rental for the service discourages this solution.

DAVID BRADLEY

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
(E-Mail Removed) <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Afternoon all,
>
> Currently on HH and looking to move to ADSL - I do want to keep my
> second analogue number so regardless of what I do it does mean a
> second line with that number transfered to it.
>
> Current BT line check says we should be OK for 2MB prior to checks etc
> etc.
>
> My prefered route is to have a 2nd line now and transfer the number
> over whilst still keeping HH for the short term (BT will renumber the
> 2nd analogue line). I have to hope that this second line will be OK
> for ADSL and then have BT take HH off the line - if not have to hope
> that when HH comes put ADSL can go on that.
>
> I could go a migrated route and try to get BT to add a new line order
> on the back of that to be done at the same time but I prefer the idea
> of being able to change over in my own time rather than all at one
> time on the same day.
>
> I'm risking a new second line though on the fact I will be able to get
> ADSL on either that or my current line - has anybody any experience of
> a BT line check suggesting your OK for 2MB only to find that when push
> came to shove they couldn't ?
>
> Many thanks for any input.


Your approach might work - but if the new line turns out to be unsuitable
for ADSL, you could have problems and - at best - would then have to have
the HH line downgraded and converted, so you wouldn't have both facilities
in parallel.

Do you actually *need* two voice lines to be in concurrent use - or you do
you simply need an additional *number* - for example for a fax machine?

If the latter, you could use Call Sign and have the second HH analog number
as your alternative number. Yet another alternative if you *do* need a
separate line is to use Broadband Voice for the second line - but you
definitely wouldn't be able to keep the second HH number if you did this.

If the second line *is* for fax, you may not need it! Many BB ISPs provide a
fax to email service along with an 0845 number. This would take care of
incoming faxes without tying up a phone line. You'd have to use the main
line for outgoing faxes, but that would be under your control and may not be
a problem unless you send a lot of them.
--
Cheers,
Tim
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is Black Hole!

David Bradley wrote:

Thanks for the feedback David, appreciated. More the better !

> I may be wromg but it seems to me that your approach has some fatal
> flaws.

"Educated chances" :-)

> If you have a new line installed to which ADSL is applied
> then, so far as I am aware, if the number is chaged then the ADSL
> facility is lost and a fresh application has to be made for the ADSL
> service with all the associated costs and delay.

Correct as I understand too but I would have my 2nd analogue number
applied to it on installation before (hopefully) having ADSL applied to
it. The 2nd analogue line on the HH box would be renumbered.

1) New Line with current 2nd HH Number
2) Check its OK for ADSL (Fingers crossed)
3) Select cosen ADSL ISP for this line

> I also have a gut feeling the while a line can be 'downgraded' to an
> analogue service [for a fee], thus retaining the primary number,

HH conversion back to a standard line is 50.00 regardless of whether its
a migrated conversion or not although I think BT Openworld will waive
this fee if you go with them for an HH->ADSL conversion which seems
somewhat "unfair" on other ISP's

> you
> can't have the choice of having the 2nd or 3rd numbers that were
> associated with the HH service.

It seems you can have these numbers transferred to another line if you
wish but as above I would take my chosen number away before conversion
back to . If you take your number to an exiting ADSL line then yes you
would end up with potenmtial problems.

Tiscali Tim wrote:

Thanks Tim also for the reply,

> Your approach might work - but if the new line turns out to be unsuitable
> for ADSL, you could have problems and - at best - would then have to have
> the HH line downgraded and converted, so you wouldn't have both facilities
> in parallel.

They would only be running in parallel for a short time I hope as soon
as ADSL is up and running on the new line HH coms out. Thats would be my
plan !

> Do you actually *need* two voice lines to be in concurrent use

Yes.

> - or you do
> you simply need an additional *number* - for example for a fax machine?

No I need to keep the 2nd analogue number and have no/minimal downtime
on it. Thats the problem causer really and the reason of my thinking
getting a 2nd line first with that number on is the best way to work.

> If the latter, you could use Call Sign and have the second HH analog number
> as your alternative number. Yet another alternative if you *do* need a
> separate line is to use Broadband Voice for the second line - but you
> definitely wouldn't be able to keep the second HH number if you did this.

Thanks - Callsign and Broadband Voice both considered but not really a
suitable answer.

> If the second line *is* for fax, you may not need it! Many BB ISPs provide a
[..]

Again thanks for the thought but not the reason for needing the 2nd
libne.

My only "risk" I guess is what chance is there of not being able to have
ADSL on either a new 2nd line our our current line when BT currently
say we should be OK for up to 2MB.

Thanks again folks.

In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
(E-Mail Removed) writes
>No I need to keep the 2nd analogue number and have no/minimal downtime
>on it. Thats the problem causer really and the reason of my thinking
>getting a 2nd line first with that number on is the best way to work.

I did something similar, although without the numbering change bit. I
need at least two parallel phone lines and really didn't want to risk
any downtime, so had an extra line installed. This gives the advantage
of having ISDN backup to the ADSL, which my Draytek router handles
transparently. Unfortunately BT made a complete mess of the installation
(in the hole they dug and refilled), leaving me without either line for
almost a week. Dropping from using bonded HH to a GSM modem is no fun...

Moral - make sure you double check everything before BT leave. On this
occasion I'd had to go out, leaving my wife with the BT men. When they
said it was sorted, she just believed them...

Matt
--
Matthew Haigh --$matthaigh{News04}$@haigh.org--
GCRSoft, providing SMS solutions since 1996...
http://www.gcrsoft.com http://www.moretext.com

Matthew Haigh <$matthaigh{News05}$@haigh.org> writes
>I did something similar, although without the numbering change bit. I
>need at least two parallel phone lines and really didn't want to risk
>any downtime, so had an extra line installed. This gives the advantage
>of having ISDN backup to the ADSL, which my Draytek router handles
>transparently. Unfortunately BT made a complete mess of the installation
>(in the hole they dug and refilled), leaving me without either line for
>almost a week. Dropping from using bonded HH to a GSM modem is no fun...

How much do BT charge for installing the extra line? Is it just the
standard line install as per the BT price list?

I'd like to do something much the same as the above, except that once
ADSL is up and running I'd like to downgrade the HH line back to POTS.
At which point it would probably make sense to get rid of BT Working
Together. Would this cost me just 2x the standard BT line rental?

In the end I might get rid of the first (ex HH) line, so I'd like the
main phone number to be transferred to the second (ADSL) line. Would
this present a problem?

I understand there's a UKP50 downgrade charge for the HH line, so
perhaps I'll get rid of the 1st (HH) line altogether once I'm happy with
my ADSL installation. Is there a charge for getting rid of a phone line?
--
Simon Elliott
http://www.ctsn.co.uk/

Simon Elliott wrote:

> How much do BT charge for installing the extra line? Is it just the
> standard line install as per the BT price list?

Yes - currently 74.99 for a new second line. If it was important (as it
is to me) you could take one of your current HH numbers to it, in my
case my second analogue number. This second number on the HH line would
then get a new number.

> I'd like to do something much the same as the above, except that once
> ADSL is up and running I'd like to downgrade the HH line back to POTS.
> At which point it would probably make sense to get rid of BT Working
> Together. Would this cost me just 2x the standard BT line rental?

Thats exactly what I want to do - yes you would have two lines with 2 x
line rentals at whatever monthly rate you want. Basic with no frills is
9.50/month if paid by DD or 10.50 if not and includes 2.15 call
allowance altough if the second line goes "on the same account/bill" it
seems to be 9.99 regardless and benefits from any Options on the primary
number.

> In the end I might get rid of the first (ex HH) line, so I'd like the
> main phone number to be transferred to the second (ADSL) line. Would
> this present a problem?

As far as I am aware it would be a problem with regard renumbering as
far as BT is concerned but you may have problems if your renumbering a
ADSL enabled line. Seems ISP/BT work to numbers rather than lines so it
could all go pearshaped as far as ADSL is concerned.

You could consider taking your primary number to the new line before you
put ADSL on it saving that possible problem ?

> I understand there's a UKP50 downgrade charge for the HH line, so
> perhaps I'll get rid of the 1st (HH) line altogether once I'm happy with
> my ADSL installation. Is there a charge for getting rid of a phone line?

The current 50.00 conversion of HH -> Single Line is paybale to BT
whether you arrange it to come out or if it were part of a managed
conversion with a Broadband provider. Not sure of the situation of just
terminating - if your outside your inital 12 month contract I guess
nothing if you give the correct notice.

(E-Mail Removed) wrote:

> > In the end I might get rid of the first (ex HH) line, so I'd like the
> > main phone number to be transferred to the second (ADSL) line. Would
> > this present a problem?
>
> As far as I am aware it would be a problem with regard renumbering as
> far as BT is concerned but you may have problems if your renumbering a
> ADSL enabled line. Seems ISP/BT work to numbers rather than lines so it
> could all go pearshaped as far as ADSL is concerned.

Oooppss..that should have read...As far as I am aware it would **not**
be a problem with regard renumbering.....