ADSL query

After months & months (actually, probably over a year!) of my sister being
unable to get online via Pipex and then TalkTalk, I finally found time to
visit and check it out.

Took my laptop with the intention of connecting directly to the main BT
socket in the kitchen as they were trying to connect in a bedroom using an
extension. First thing I noticed was that when I listened to the dial tone
on the phone, I could clearly hear the ADSL modem in the background trying
to connect ('ping' sound followed by a different dial tone sound,
repeating).

After a couple of hours dabbling and then talking to tech support who were
simply asking me to do everything I had done previously, they finally
concluded that the line was OK but the modem was faulty (I knew it wasn't).

Out of curiosity I decided to have a look inside the BT socket and found to
my surprise that it had 2 extensions connected internally. I hadn't noticed
previously how these were connected to the main socket, but I did check that
both phones were connected via filters in both bedrooms.

I disconnected both sets of four wires and had another go with the
ADSL.....Bingo!!

The thing is I don't understand why these 2 leads could cause the ADSL not
to connect, as like I said, all phones had filters connected.

I'm now left with the prospect of a follow-up visit to try to get both
bedroom's phones up and running again. I'm assuming I could put RJ11 ends
on and connect these externally via the filter on the main socket, but would
this allow the connection of the ADSL modem in a bedroom?

Also is it necessary for all 4 wires to be connected and could one or more
of these have been causing some kind of 'feedback' affecting the line
quality??

Thanks in advance

I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Nel"
<(E-Mail Removed)> opened his gob and said:

>I'm now left with the prospect of a follow-up visit to try to get both
>bedroom's phones up and running again.

Be cheaper and easier to buy a set of wireless phones.

Even easier, tell your sister the problem is with the crap wiring in
her house and get *her* to buy the wireless phones.

--
Cheers,

Guy

** Stress - the condition brought about by having to
** resist the temptation to beat the living daylights
** out of someone who richly deserves it.

Nel wrote:
> After months & months (actually, probably over a year!) of my sister being
> unable to get online via Pipex and then TalkTalk, I finally found time to
> visit and check it out.
>
> Took my laptop with the intention of connecting directly to the main BT
> socket in the kitchen as they were trying to connect in a bedroom using an
> extension. First thing I noticed was that when I listened to the dial tone
> on the phone, I could clearly hear the ADSL modem in the background trying
> to connect ('ping' sound followed by a different dial tone sound,
> repeating).
>
> After a couple of hours dabbling and then talking to tech support who were
> simply asking me to do everything I had done previously, they finally
> concluded that the line was OK but the modem was faulty (I knew it wasn't).
>
> Out of curiosity I decided to have a look inside the BT socket and found to
> my surprise that it had 2 extensions connected internally. I hadn't noticed
> previously how these were connected to the main socket, but I did check that
> both phones were connected via filters in both bedrooms.
>
> I disconnected both sets of four wires and had another go with the
> ADSL.....Bingo!!
>
> The thing is I don't understand why these 2 leads could cause the ADSL not
> to connect, as like I said, all phones had filters connected.
>
> I'm now left with the prospect of a follow-up visit to try to get both
> bedroom's phones up and running again. I'm assuming I could put RJ11 ends
> on and connect these externally via the filter on the main socket, but would
> this allow the connection of the ADSL modem in a bedroom?
>
> Also is it necessary for all 4 wires to be connected and could one or more
> of these have been causing some kind of 'feedback' affecting the line
> quality??

ADSL will *not* work through a filter therefore any line on which ADSL
is required must *not* be filtered. (The standard plug in filters with
an ADSL and a telephone socket pass the ADSL through unfiltered. All
filtering is in the telephone socket.)

If you have filters at each telephone point then you need only two wires
connected, the filter completes the "bell wire" connection. Not sure if
a single master filter does the same. At most you need only three
wires, the two signal wires, corresponding to the incoming two wire
connection, and the bell wire.
http://www.telephonesuk.co.uk/wiring_info.htm gives some information.


--
Old Codger
e-mail use reply to field

What matters in politics is not what happens, but what you can make
people believe has happened. [Janet Daley 27/8/2003]

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:22:43, Nel wrote:

>The thing is I don't understand why these 2 leads could cause the ADSL
>not to connect, as like I said, all phones had filters connected.

Because they weren't filtered, so fed reflections, interference etc back
into the ADSL enabled device?

Why oh why wasn't this the first thing that was looked for?

<duh>

--
Jim Crowther.

West London MAG: Popes Grotto, Twickenham, every Tuesday from 21:00 onwards.

On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:22:43 GMT, "Nel" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Also is it necessary for all 4 wires to be connected and could one or more
>of these have been causing some kind of 'feedback' affecting the line
>quality??

the wires on 2&5 are necessary, the one on 3 often causes problems as
its the ring wire which creates an imbalance and adds interference.

http://newsnet.googlepages.com/maxdsldiagnostics may help.

Phil

"Jim Crowther" <Don'(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) nvalid...
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:22:43, Nel wrote:
>
>>The thing is I don't understand why these 2 leads could cause the ADSL not
>>to connect, as like I said, all phones had filters connected.
>
> Because they weren't filtered, so fed reflections, interference etc back
> into the ADSL enabled device?
>
> Why oh why wasn't this the first thing that was looked for?
>
> <duh>

Not sure what you mean. I said "all phones had filters connected", then you
state "Because they weren't filtered". I said "I did check that both phones
were connected via filters in both bedrooms" yet you say "Why oh why wasn't
this the first thing that was looked for?"

But anyway, thanks for the input.....

"Dr Teeth" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
>I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Nel"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> opened his gob and said:
>
>>I'm now left with the prospect of a follow-up visit to try to get both
>>bedroom's phones up and running again.
>
> Be cheaper and easier to buy a set of wireless phones.
>
> Even easier, tell your sister the problem is with the crap wiring in
> her house and get *her* to buy the wireless phones.

I did actually mention it, and it may come to that if the extensions
continue to cause problems. But didn't you know, I'm the family
handyman......the one who is called on for EVERYTHING greater than putting a
shelf up!!! ;-)

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Nel <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> After months & months (actually, probably over a year!) of my sister
> being unable to get online via Pipex and then TalkTalk, I finally
> found time to visit and check it out.
>
> Took my laptop with the intention of connecting directly to the main
> BT socket in the kitchen as they were trying to connect in a bedroom
> using an extension. First thing I noticed was that when I listened
> to the dial tone on the phone, I could clearly hear the ADSL modem in
> the background trying to connect ('ping' sound followed by a
> different dial tone sound, repeating).
>
> After a couple of hours dabbling and then talking to tech support who
> were simply asking me to do everything I had done previously, they
> finally concluded that the line was OK but the modem was faulty (I
> knew it wasn't).
> Out of curiosity I decided to have a look inside the BT socket and
> found to my surprise that it had 2 extensions connected internally. I
> hadn't noticed previously how these were connected to the main
> socket, but I did check that both phones were connected via filters
> in both bedrooms.
> I disconnected both sets of four wires and had another go with the
> ADSL.....Bingo!!
>
> The thing is I don't understand why these 2 leads could cause the
> ADSL not to connect, as like I said, all phones had filters connected.
>
> I'm now left with the prospect of a follow-up visit to try to get both
> bedroom's phones up and running again. I'm assuming I could put RJ11
> ends on and connect these externally via the filter on the main
> socket, but would this allow the connection of the ADSL modem in a
> bedroom?
> Also is it necessary for all 4 wires to be connected and could one or
> more of these have been causing some kind of 'feedback' affecting the
> line quality??
>
> Thanks in advance


By far the best solution is to use a filtered faceplate on the master socket
in place of the standard BT faceplate. Get one which has both filtered and
unfiltered krone terminals on the back.

You can then connect the existing extension wiring into the filtered
terminals, safe in the knowledge that the filters will isolate it from the
ADSL signal and stop it interfering - however crappy it is - with it. You
won't then need plug-in filters for the phones.

However, what you *will* need is a digitial extension to wherever the ADSL
equipment is going to be. Preferably use CAT5 cable (although standard
twisted pair telephone cable will do) and krone one of the pairs (doesn't
matter which) into the unfiltered connections on the back of the faceplate.
Install an RJ11 outlet socket at the other end, and connect the centre 2
pins to whichever pair you connected the master socket end.

Have a look at http://www.clarity.it/telecoms/adsl_faceplate_mod.htm for
details about the sort of faceplate you need. Others - such as
http://www.solwise.co.uk/adsl_splitters.htm - sell similar ones.
--
Cheers,
Roger
______
Email address maintained for newsgroup use only, and not regularly
monitored.. Messages sent to it may not be read for several weeks.
PLEASE REPLY TO NEWSGROUP!

I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Nel"
<(E-Mail Removed)> opened his gob and said:

> But didn't you know, I'm the family
>handyman......the one who is called on for EVERYTHING greater than putting a
>shelf up!!! ;-)

I'm the computer fixit man in my family, and often I do what is easier
for me. Hours wasted trying to trace a weird problem caused by daily
abuse or a reinstall? No contest <g>.

--
Cheers,

Guy

** Stress - the condition brought about by having to
** resist the temptation to beat the living daylights
** out of someone who richly deserves it.

"Dr Teeth" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news(E-Mail Removed)...
>I was just thinking how wonderful life was, when "Nel"
> <(E-Mail Removed)> opened his gob and said:
>
>> But didn't you know, I'm the family
>>handyman......the one who is called on for EVERYTHING greater than putting
>>a
>>shelf up!!! ;-)
>
> I'm the computer fixit man in my family, and often I do what is easier
> for me. Hours wasted trying to trace a weird problem caused by daily
> abuse or a reinstall? No contest <g>.

That one's easy. Whenever anyone get's a new PC or it comes to mine for
fixing, I do a ghost image of the drive and keep a copy of the disks. When
I get the call, I just say "bang this in, it'll fix it!" :-)