ADSL availability check with phone number?!?

Hi all,

Why the hell all the adsl ISPs I have seen online ask me my phone
number to check my ADSL availability?

I checked ukonline, wanadoo, zenhome1000.

Am I obliged to get a BT or other provider phone line so that I can put
ADSL and then I can remove my phone line later on?!?

How does it work here in Uk?

I understand (Better saying I know, I do not understand quite well)
that I need to pay the rent of the line or something like that but am I
oblied to make another subscription I dont want to to get the ADSL I
want? Can't they arrange with BT directly?

Do u know a provider that does not care about the phone number for
bringing you ADSL?

Many thanks

Cheers,
Irena

PS The place where I will live does not have Cable otherwise I would
have already chosen.

On 2 Dec 2004 in uk.telecom.broadband, "Irena" wrote:

>Am I obliged to get a BT or other provider phone line ...

>How does it work here in Uk?

You can have ADSL service on a line from BT, using any of 50+ ISPs.
You have to pay line rental for voice service, to BT, before they'll
allow ADSL service to run on the line (even if you never use it for a
voice call, you must rent that service).

In some places, there are other firms (ISP/Telco) which can provide a
line under a different scheme, called LLU (Local Loop Unbundling) which
means they rent the line from BT and then charge you a monthly fee for
the line. This is likely to be a more expensive option and is not as
widely available. So if you gave your postcode, someone might be able
to help identify what services you could use (or see www.samknows.com )

I am sure someone will correct me if the details I gave are wrong :-)

Maybe you should explain (a) what service (speed) you want, and
(b) how long you want to use it. There are some deals for cheaper
line rental from a company called IT plc (www.itplc.com) but not all
of their service is cheap and they have higher installation fees I think.

Good luck. Peter Morgan.





--
PlusNet <http://tinyurl.com/24ymz> - I recommend them and save some cash.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

On 02/12/04, 19:47:41, "Irena" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote regarding
ADSL availability check with phone number?!?:


> Hi all,

> Why the hell all the adsl ISPs I have seen online ask me my phone
> number to check my ADSL availability?

> I checked ukonline, wanadoo, zenhome1000.

> Am I obliged to get a BT or other provider phone line so that I can put
> ADSL and then I can remove my phone line later on?!?

> How does it work here in Uk?

> I understand (Better saying I know, I do not understand quite well)
> that I need to pay the rent of the line or something like that but am I
> oblied to make another subscription I dont want to to get the ADSL I
> want? Can't they arrange with BT directly?

> Do u know a provider that does not care about the phone number for
> bringing you ADSL?

> Many thanks

> Cheers,
> Irena

> PS The place where I will live does not have Cable otherwise I would
> have already chosen.

ADSL is telephone line based technology, so you need a telephone line in
your house/work to get ADSL. The ADSL providers check your telephone line
to see if it is of sufficient quality to be eligible for ADSL. Hence the
need for your telephone number.

Regards Ian Donaldson

Newtownards
Northern Ireland
(E-Mail Removed)

In message <(E-Mail Removed)>
Peter M <us-(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> >Am I obliged to get a BT or other provider phone line ...

> >How does it work here in Uk?

> You can have ADSL service on a line from BT, using any of 50+ ISPs.
> You have to pay line rental for voice service, to BT, before they'll
> allow ADSL service to run on the line (even if you never use it for a
> voice call, you must rent that service).

That's one way of looking at it, I suppose, but 'rental for voice
service' is perhaps a bit misleading/confusing in the context of the
question.

You pay line rental only for the line.

As the originator of voice/fax calls has to pay for them, incoming calls
are 'free'.

Any other use of the line is charged on top of line rental, whether
ADSL, outgoing voice/fax calls, or stray 'services' such as wake-up
calls.

ADSL is 'always on', i.e. the charge is X per month (and included in the
charge made by whatever 'Internet Service Provider' is chosen).

Outgoing voice/fax calls, and 'services', are billed/charged by BT: if
you don't have/make any such calls, there are no such charges.

--
Peter Duck <(E-Mail Removed)>

Peter Duck wrote:

> You pay line rental only for the line.

Do u mean that I can choose a "formula" that allows me to rent the line
only? And on top of that I can choose my ISP?

I have not seen anything like that in http://www.bt.co.uk

They simply offer voice calls formulas.
Or did I miss something here...

Thanks for your reply
Irena

In message <(E-Mail Removed). com>
"Irena" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> > You pay line rental only for the line.

> Do u mean that I can choose a "formula" that allows me to rent the line
> only? And on top of that I can choose my ISP?

> I have not seen anything like that in http://www.bt.co.uk

> They simply offer voice calls formulas.
> Or did I miss something here...

As I thought I'd explained, what you call 'voice call formulas' are
charged for in two parts - line rental and <calls made from that number
+ any 'services' used>.

If you make no voice/fax calls from that number, and don't use any of
the 'services', there will be no charges apart from the line-rental.
There's not a separate 'formula' for this - it just results from the way
in which a 'normal' line is billed.

(You may as well have a phone plugged-in, for incoming calls and in case
you need to make 'emergency' (999/112) calls: I half-remember that it's
nominally a 'contract requirement' that you should have a phone capable
of emergency-calls.
Neither 'incoming' nor 999/112 calls are charged-for, but probably few
people are well-disciplined, or motivated, enough to never make any
other outgoing calls just to avoid the charges!)

And 'Yes, you can/do choose your ISP separately'
You pay the ISP for ADSL, but (a large) part of these charges (including
'installation') is paid by the ISP to BT - you don't pay BT directly for
their role in carrying ADSL to/from you.

--
Peter Duck <(E-Mail Removed)>

Peter Duck wrote:
> In message <(E-Mail Removed). com>
> "Irena" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > > You pay line rental only for the line.
>
> > Do u mean that I can choose a "formula" that allows me to rent the
line
> > only? And on top of that I can choose my ISP?
>
> > I have not seen anything like that in http://www.bt.co.uk
>
> > They simply offer voice calls formulas.
> > Or did I miss something here...
>
> As I thought I'd explained, what you call 'voice call formulas' are
> charged for in two parts - line rental and <calls made from that
number
> + any 'services' used>.

You explained quite well your point, Peter.

Sorry if I insist, but if I go to visit the BT site, I find services
for home that include phone calls too. I have not found a service that
says: "line rental" only.

For example: BT together, BT together internationals, BT boradband;
they all include phone calls or the Internet in the monthly package. I
don't think these services are free, they are included as a "flat
tarif" on top of this misterious "line rental" tarif that I don't see
it alone anywhere.

But it can be that I don't know where to look for it.

Maybe you can help me in finding the right webpage...

I don't want a phone line because I use a VOIP software on my computer
that works quite well when you have broadband and is cheaper than any
other traditional telco operators (that I have seen so far).
Thanks a lot for your reply.
Irena

In news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com,
Irena <(E-Mail Removed)> opined very noisily:
> Peter Duck wrote:
>> In message <(E-Mail Removed). com>
>> "Irena" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>
>>>> You pay line rental only for the line.
>>
>>> Do u mean that I can choose a "formula" that allows me to rent the
>>> line only? And on top of that I can choose my ISP?
>>
>>> I have not seen anything like that in http://www.bt.co.uk
>>
>>> They simply offer voice calls formulas.
>>> Or did I miss something here...
>>
>> As I thought I'd explained, what you call 'voice call formulas' are
>> charged for in two parts - line rental and <calls made from that
>> number + any 'services' used>.
>
> You explained quite well your point, Peter.
>
> Sorry if I insist, but if I go to visit the BT site, I find services
> for home that include phone calls too. I have not found a service that
> says: "line rental" only.
>
> For example: BT together, BT together internationals, BT boradband;
> they all include phone calls or the Internet in the monthly package. I
> don't think these services are free, they are included as a "flat
> tarif" on top of this misterious "line rental" tarif that I don't see
> it alone anywhere.
>
> But it can be that I don't know where to look for it.
>
> Maybe you can help me in finding the right webpage...
>
> I don't want a phone line because I use a VOIP software on my computer
> that works quite well when you have broadband and is cheaper than any
> other traditional telco operators (that I have seen so far).
> Thanks a lot for your reply.
> Irena

http://www.bt.com/Choices/calls.jsp?...K&obsOID=34207

BT option 1 is the nearest you can get to " Line only" nowadays the Extras
are " Free"

http://www.bt.com/btcom_redirectLink...0&obsType=LINK

Taken from The above link




Connecting a new residential phone line
The connection charge is £74.99*. However, if you are a new
customer and your new home is already connected to BT from the previous
occupiers, this charge is not likely to apply.

New customers - Taking over an existing BT phone line
If you take over an existing BT phone line, there is no charge.

If your household was previously connected to BT and you are out
of your 12 month contract, we will reconnect a BT phone line completely
free. If damage has occurred to your BT line or socket, charges will apply.
Customers who have been disconnected for non payment of a BT bill will be
charged £35.25 for reconnection. Charges apply to reconnect from a previous
Home Highway line. Terms and conditions apply.

Order now >>


For more information about connecting to BT for the first time,
please contact 0800 800 150

New customers - Call levels
This is a free service which removes the need to pay a deposit
for virtually all new customers.

New customers will be asked to agree with us a quarterly call
level which represents the maximum value of calls they would expect to make
in a quarter (including VAT but excluding any call discounts).

If the call level is reached before the normal quarterly bill is
due to be sent out, BT will contact the customer to agree a course of
action.



So it appears that you can agree a level of quarterly calls. In your case
you would go for Zero or the minimum that BT will allow.
If you don't use the Phone you will not pay any more than the £10.50 which
effectively IS the line rental

if you want to look at the following URL

http://www.serviceview.bt.com/list/h...&obsNoSee=true

This is the BT price list --- - Enjoy
--

Yddap
Remove guts to reply

Yddap wrote:
>
http://www.bt.com/Choices/calls.jsp?...K&obsOID=34207
>
> BT option 1 is the nearest you can get to " Line only" nowadays the
Extras
> are " Free"
>
> (...)
>
> So it appears that you can agree a level of quarterly calls. In your
case
> you would go for Zero or the minimum that BT will allow.

BT should allow me to pay Zero. Why shouldn't they?

> If you don't use the Phone you will not pay any more than the £10.50
which effectively IS the line rental

That's what I suspected :-)
Description of Option 1 says:
----
Just £10.50* per month if paying by Monthly Payment Plan or Direct
Debit, includes rental of your first line
----
IMHO, writing "includes rental of your first line" does not mean that
this *is* the rental of the line, but that there is something added on
top of it. So to say, extras are not free IMHO.

As I see it, BT carges you compulsorly x £ per months (could also be
50% or more, who knows?) as flat rate for taking advantages of a
discount on national/local calls - either if you want it or not.

But they will never tell you like this and will never say how much it
is. I call this abuse of an ex monopolist. But it is a common practice
in many european countries.

It would be interesting knowing how the consumer association sees this.
Thanks for the links.

Cheers,
Irena

Yddap wrote:
>
http://www.bt.com/Choices/calls.jsp?...K&obsOID=34207
>
> BT option 1 is the nearest you can get to " Line only" nowadays the
Extras
> are " Free"
>
> (...)
>
> So it appears that you can agree a level of quarterly calls. In your
case
> you would go for Zero or the minimum that BT will allow.

BT should allow me to pay Zero. Why shouldn't they?

> If you don't use the Phone you will not pay any more than the £10.50
which effectively IS the line rental

That's what I suspected :-)
Description of Option 1 says:
----
Just £10.50* per month if paying by Monthly Payment Plan or Direct
Debit, includes rental of your first line
----
IMHO, writing "includes rental of your first line" does not mean that
this *is* the rental of the line, but that there is something added on
top of it. So to say, extras are not free IMHO.

As I see it, BT carges you compulsorly x £ per months (could also be
50% or more, who knows?) as flat rate for taking advantages of a
discount on national/local calls - either if you want it or not.

But they will never tell you like this and will never say how much it
is. I call this abuse of an ex monopolist. But it is a common practice
in many european countries.

It would be interesting knowing how the consumer association sees this.
Thanks for the links.

Cheers,
Irena